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Veset: Difference between revisions
From Halachipedia
→Increasing or decreasing intervals
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# In fact, if a woman has a alternating pattern switching between the 15th of the month and the 16th, by seeing this switch 3 times, which is altogether 6 periods, she establishes a veset.<ref>Raavad ([http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=8785&st=&pgnum=51 Baalei Hanefesh p. 53]), Taz 189:10, Shach 189:21. See there in Raavad who treats this as two separate vestot, while the Shach treats it as single cyclical pattern.</ref> | # In fact, if a woman has a alternating pattern switching between the 15th of the month and the 16th, by seeing this switch 3 times, which is altogether 6 periods, she establishes a veset.<ref>Raavad ([http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=8785&st=&pgnum=51 Baalei Hanefesh p. 53]), Taz 189:10, Shach 189:21. See there in Raavad who treats this as two separate vestot, while the Shach treats it as single cyclical pattern.</ref> | ||
====Increasing or decreasing intervals==== | ====Increasing or decreasing intervals==== | ||
# If a woman sees for a certain intervals that are increasing over time that establishes a veset. There is a dispute if three or four times is necessary to establish a veset. For example, if she sees after 30 days, then after 31, then after 32, the woman would have to consider herself as having a veset but also be strict as though she didn't have a veset.<ref>The Gemara Niddah 64a records a dispute between Rav and Shmuel regarding an increasing veset of days during the month. Rav holds that it is established with three times and Shmuel holds it is established with four times since you need four times in order to establish three increases. Tosfot s.v. itmar extends this idea to increasing intervals. The opinion of Tosfot is codified by Tur and Shulchan Aruch YD 189:5. The Shach 189:6 explains that to establish a veset of increasing intervals for Rav it would take seeing four times which is equal to three intervals and according to Shmuel seeing five times which is equal to four intervals. Taz 189:6 agrees. Shulchan | # If a woman sees for a certain intervals that are increasing over time that establishes a veset. There is a dispute if three or four times is necessary to establish a veset. For example, if she sees after 30 days, then after 31, then after 32, the woman would have to consider herself as having a veset but also be strict as though she didn't have a veset.<ref>The Gemara Niddah 64a records a dispute between Rav and Shmuel regarding an increasing veset of days during the month. Rav holds that it is established with three times and Shmuel holds it is established with four times since you need four times in order to establish three increases. Tosfot s.v. itmar extends this idea to increasing intervals. The opinion of Tosfot is codified by Tur and Shulchan Aruch YD 189:5. The Shach 189:6 explains that to establish a veset of increasing intervals for Rav it would take seeing four times which is equal to three intervals and according to Shmuel seeing five times which is equal to four intervals. Taz 189:6 agrees. Shulchan Aruch 189:7 rules that we're strict for both the opinion of Rav and Shmuel. Shoshanat Haa'makim 7:2b agrees</ref> | ||
# Increasing intervals can be established whether they increase by one day at a time or multiple days as long as it is consistent. <ref>Rashba (Mishmeret Habayit 11b), Maggid | # Increasing intervals can be established whether they increase by one day at a time or multiple days as long as it is consistent. <ref>Rashba (Mishmeret Habayit 11b), Maggid Mishna (Isurei Biyah 8:6), Shulchan Aruch 189:5, Shach 189:11</ref> However, intervals that progressively increase (e.g. 30, 31, 33, 36) isn't considered a halachic pattern to create a veset.<ref>Shach 189:12</ref> | ||
# A decreasing veset is established just like an increasing veset.<ref> Shach 189:9 and Shach 189:68. See Tosfot Niddah 9b s.v. pichta. Sidrei Tahara 189:3 supports the Shach from the Raavad 3:6. The Peleti 189:6 accepts the Raavad's opinion but wonders how it is | # A decreasing veset is established just like an increasing veset.<ref> Shach 189:9 and Shach 189:68, Shoshanat Haa'makim 7:2b. See Tosfot Niddah 9b s.v. pichta. Sidrei Tahara 189:3 supports the Shach from the Raavad 3:6. The Peleti 189:6 accepts the Raavad's opinion but wonders how it is rational, since eventually the veset should run to the point that she won't see anymore and isn't a natural progression.</ref> | ||
====Veset for Hours==== | ====Veset for Hours==== | ||
# If a woman establishes three times that she always starts seeing her period a certain hour of the day but doesn't establish any day for her veset (either by intervals or by of the month), then she is concerned about her regular non-kavuah vestot only for that hour.<ref>The Raavad ([http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=8785&st=&pgnum=30 Baalei Hanefesh p. 32]) writes that if a woman has a veset only for a specific hour during the day and not for days that can establish a veset for that hour. Shulchan Aruch 189:3 codifies the opinion of the Raavad. Chavot Daat 189:4 explains that if she doesn’t have a veset for days and does have an established hour, she only needs to keep her non-kavuah vestot during that hour that she has a veset for.</ref> | # If a woman establishes three times that she always starts seeing her period a certain hour of the day but doesn't establish any day for her veset (either by intervals or by of the month), then she is concerned about her regular non-kavuah vestot only for that hour.<ref>The Raavad ([http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=8785&st=&pgnum=30 Baalei Hanefesh p. 32]) writes that if a woman has a veset only for a specific hour during the day and not for days that can establish a veset for that hour. Shulchan Aruch 189:3 codifies the opinion of the Raavad. Chavot Daat 189:4 explains that if she doesn’t have a veset for days and does have an established hour, she only needs to keep her non-kavuah vestot during that hour that she has a veset for.</ref> | ||
