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Veset: Difference between revisions
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# If a woman sees her period after an interval of a certain number of days that is called a veset haflagah. For example, if she sees every 28 days that is a veset.<ref>Gemara Niddah 63b, Tur and Shulchan YD 184:1</ref> | # If a woman sees her period after an interval of a certain number of days that is called a veset haflagah. For example, if she sees every 28 days that is a veset.<ref>Gemara Niddah 63b, Tur and Shulchan YD 184:1</ref> | ||
# If a woman sees her period on a certain day on the Hebrew calendar that is called a veset hachodesh.<ref>The Gemara Niddah 39b and 64a both use cases of veset that are tied to the monthly calendar. Tosfot 64a s.v. itmar explains that a veset is established by the Jewish calendar even if some months are 29 days and others are 30. This is also the opinion of the Raavad ([http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=8785&st=&pgnum=46 Baalei Hanefesh p. 48] cited by Rashba), Rashba (Taharat Habayit 9a and Mishmeret Habayit 9a), Rambam (Isurei Biyah 8:6), Maggid Mishna (Isurei Biyah 8:6), Tur and Shulchan Aruch 189:6. Even though the Ramban (Chiddushim 64a) questions this approach in his Hilchot Niddah 5:12 he accepted it.</ref> | # If a woman sees her period on a certain day on the Hebrew calendar that is called a veset hachodesh.<ref>The Gemara Niddah 39b and 64a both use cases of veset that are tied to the monthly calendar. Tosfot 64a s.v. itmar explains that a veset is established by the Jewish calendar even if some months are 29 days and others are 30. This is also the opinion of the Raavad ([http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=8785&st=&pgnum=46 Baalei Hanefesh p. 48] cited by Rashba), Rashba (Taharat Habayit 9a and Mishmeret Habayit 9a), Rambam (Isurei Biyah 8:6), Maggid Mishna (Isurei Biyah 8:6), Tur and Shulchan Aruch 189:6. Even though the Ramban (Chiddushim 64a) questions this approach in his Hilchot Niddah 5:12 he accepted it.</ref> | ||
## A woman who usually sees on a day of the week every certain number of works that creates a veset. For example, if she saw on Sunday and then 29 days later on a Sunday she needs to be concerned about the Sunday after four weeks later. That weeks a veset with three times and is a veset sheino kavuah with one time. <ref>Niddah 11a, Rashba (Torat Habayit 9a), Shulchan Aruch YD 189:6</ref> | ## A woman who usually sees on a day of the week every certain number of works that creates a veset. For example, if she saw on Sunday and then 29 days later on a Sunday she needs to be concerned about the Sunday after four weeks later. That weeks a veset with three times and is a veset sheino kavuah with one time. <ref>Niddah 11a, Rashba (Torat Habayit 9a), Shulchan Aruch YD 189:6</ref> If a veset of the day of the week can be viewed as a veset of haflagah we look at it as a veset of haflagah.<Ref>Chavot Daat 189:4 writes that if the veset of the day of the week is established as a haflagah of the same day of the week then it is a veset of haflagah. For example, if a woman saw on 4 Sundays 3 weeks apart then she has a veset of haflagah of 22 days. However, if she only saw 3 times like that then she only has a veset for every third Sunday. Igrot Moshe YD 1:122 isn't certain that we follow the Chavot Daat where the veset of the day of the week is consistent but is sure that we follow a haflagah if the day of the week is increasing.</ref> | ||
# A woman who doesn't have a fixed | # A woman who doesn't have a fixed veset (established with 3 times), which is very common, has to observe a veset on the 30th day from her last period and that is called an Onah Beynonit.<ref> | ||
* Rashi Niddah 15a s.v. Bitoch explains that a woman is concerned about a 30 day veset since by default that's when a woman sees her period. The Ramban (Chiddushim 15a s.v. vehu) supports this opinion from the Yerushalmi Niddah 2:4. The Rashba ([http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=8922&st=&pgnum=367 Torat Habayit 15a]) based on Rashi writes that any woman who doesn't have a fixed veset needs to be concerned about the Onah Beynonit. The Ran Shevuot 4b-5a s.v. garsinan understood Rashi that there's an Onah Beynonit even if a woman has a fixed veset but argues that the concern of Onah Beynonit should only exist if she doesn't have a fixed veset. The idea of an Onah Beynonit is codified by the Tur and Shulchan Aruch 189:1. | * Rashi Niddah 15a s.v. Bitoch explains that a woman is concerned about a 30 day veset since by default that's when a woman sees her period. The Ramban (Chiddushim 15a s.v. vehu) supports this opinion from the Yerushalmi Niddah 2:4. The Rashba ([http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=8922&st=&pgnum=367 Torat Habayit 15a]) based on Rashi writes that any woman who doesn't have a fixed veset needs to be concerned about the Onah Beynonit. The Ran Shevuot 4b-5a s.v. garsinan understood Rashi that there's an Onah Beynonit even if a woman has a fixed veset but argues that the concern of Onah Beynonit should only exist if she doesn't have a fixed veset. The idea of an Onah Beynonit is codified by the Tur and Shulchan Aruch 189:1. | ||
* The Shach 189:30 quotes many rishonim who don't quote the concept of Onah Beynonit. Furthermore, he concludes the Onah Beynonit will almost always fall out at the same time as the veset hachodesh. Sidrei Tahara 189:12 offers a few cases where they don't align. The Chacham Tzvi 114 argues with the Shach and defends Shulchan Aruch. Pri Deah (Siftei Levi 189:30) writes that the majority of poskim do not hold like the Shach. </ref> | * The Shach 189:30 quotes many rishonim who don't quote the concept of Onah Beynonit. Furthermore, he concludes the Onah Beynonit will almost always fall out at the same time as the veset hachodesh. Sidrei Tahara 189:12 offers a few cases where they don't align. The Chacham Tzvi 114 argues with the Shach and defends Shulchan Aruch. Pri Deah (Siftei Levi 189:30) writes that the majority of poskim do not hold like the Shach. </ref> | ||
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==How to uproot a veset== | ==How to uproot a veset== | ||
# For a veset hachodesh seeing an earlier day during the month doesn't uproot the veset unless that day comes and passes without seeing blood.<ref>Bet Yosef 189:13(2) s.v. v'im tomar, Shach 189:31</ref> | # For a veset hachodesh seeing an earlier day during the month doesn't uproot the veset unless that day comes and passes without seeing blood.<ref>Bet Yosef 189:13(2) s.v. v'im tomar, Shach 189:31</ref> | ||
# For a veset haflagah there is a dispute whether the shorter interval uproots a longer interval. Many poskim hold it doesn't uproot it.<ref>Bet Yosef 189:13 and Darkei Moshe 189:1 imply that a shorter period doesn't uproot a longer interval. This is also the opinion of the Taz 189:18. Shach 189:31 holds that it does. Badei Hashulchan (Tziyunim 132) writes that we don’t hold like the Shach that a shorter interval uproots a longer one. </ref> | # For a veset haflagah there is a dispute whether the shorter interval uproots a longer interval. Many poskim hold it doesn't uproot it.<ref>Bet Yosef 189:13 and Darkei Moshe 189:1 imply that a shorter period doesn't uproot a longer interval. This is also the opinion of the Taz 189:18 and [http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=36277&st=&pgnum=124 Beit Meir 189:13]. Shach 189:31 holds that it does. Badei Hashulchan (Tziyunim 132) writes that we don’t hold like the Shach that a shorter interval uproots a longer one. </ref> | ||
# If a woman saw prior to her veset, the next haflagah interval is counted from that time she just saw and she doesn't need to worry about the veset as it fell out from the last interval. For example, if a woman saw on the 1st and 20th of Nissan, her haflagah (20 days) lands on the 9th of Iyar. But if she sees earlier on the 1st of Iyar she doesn't have to be to concerned about the 9th of Iyar since the new haflagah is calculated from the last period. Therefore, her veset haflagah would be the 12th of Iyar and the 20th of Iyar. <ref>Ramban (Hilchot Niddah 5:22) writes that if a woman sees on the 1st and 20th of Nissan and didn't see on the 1st of Iyar she's concerned about the 9th of Iyar because of the haflagah of 20 days. Bet Yosef 189:13 infers that if she did see on the 1st of Iyar she wouldn't be concerned about the 9th of Iyar. The Darkei Moshe 189:1 argues that the Ramban was giving a unique case but the halacha is that she should be concerned for the 9th of Iyar whether or not she saw on the 1st of Iyar. The Rama 189:13 rules according to his opinion in the Darkei Moshe. While the Taz 189:19 defends the position of the Rama, the Bach 189:16 and Shach 189:31 strongly disagree because once she sees for a shorter interval of 12 days she uprooted her interval of 20 days. Even if one disagrees with the Shach, another reason to disagree with the Taz is that we restart haflagah count from the last time she saw (Bach 16, Sidrei Tahara 14, [http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=36277&st=&pgnum=124 Beit Meir 189:13]). Badei HaShulchan 189:106 is lenient but adds that one who is strict for the Rama 189:13 and Taz 189:19 should be blessed.</ref> | # If a woman saw prior to her veset, the next haflagah interval is counted from that time she just saw and she doesn't need to worry about the veset as it fell out from the last interval. For example, if a woman saw on the 1st and 20th of Nissan, her haflagah (20 days) lands on the 9th of Iyar. But if she sees earlier on the 1st of Iyar she doesn't have to be to concerned about the 9th of Iyar since the new haflagah is calculated from the last period. Therefore, her veset haflagah would be the 12th of Iyar and the 20th of Iyar. <ref>Ramban (Hilchot Niddah 5:22) writes that if a woman sees on the 1st and 20th of Nissan and didn't see on the 1st of Iyar she's concerned about the 9th of Iyar because of the haflagah of 20 days. Bet Yosef 189:13 infers that if she did see on the 1st of Iyar she wouldn't be concerned about the 9th of Iyar. The Darkei Moshe 189:1 argues that the Ramban was giving a unique case but the halacha is that she should be concerned for the 9th of Iyar whether or not she saw on the 1st of Iyar. The Rama 189:13 rules according to his opinion in the Darkei Moshe. While the Taz 189:19 defends the position of the Rama, the Bach 189:16 and Shach 189:31 strongly disagree because once she sees for a shorter interval of 12 days she uprooted her interval of 20 days. Even if one disagrees with the Shach, another reason to disagree with the Taz is that we restart haflagah count from the last time she saw (Bach 16, Sidrei Tahara 14, [http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=36277&st=&pgnum=124 Beit Meir 189:13]). Badei HaShulchan 189:106 is lenient but adds that one who is strict for the Rama 189:13 and Taz 189:19 should be blessed.</ref> | ||
# If a woman saw before the 30th day she doesn't need to worry about the original 30th day and just recalculates the Onah Beynonit from the last time she saw.<ref>Bach 189:16, Chavot Daat 189:13, Rabbi Akiva Eiger 189:3. This is unlike the position of the Taz 189:17.</ref> For example, if a woman saw on the 18th day after her last period she doesn't need to be concerned about the Onah Beynonit from her last interval which would land 12 days after her period (which could be her tevilah night). Rather the Onah Beynonit is reset and she is concerned for the 30th day from her last period. | # If a woman saw before the 30th day she doesn't need to worry about the original 30th day and just recalculates the Onah Beynonit from the last time she saw.<ref>Bach 189:16, Chavot Daat 189:13, Rabbi Akiva Eiger 189:3. This is unlike the position of the Taz 189:17.</ref> For example, if a woman saw on the 18th day after her last period she doesn't need to be concerned about the Onah Beynonit from her last interval which would land 12 days after her period (which could be her tevilah night). Rather the Onah Beynonit is reset and she is concerned for the 30th day from her last period. | ||
