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Davening with a Minyan: Difference between revisions
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→Who Counts for a Minyan?
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# A child can't be counted for a minyan. There is an opinion who allows counting a child for the tenth person if there's nine other adults. Ashkenazim can rely on that upon in an extenuating circumstance.<ref> Rabbi Yehoshua Ben Levi (Brachot 47b) said that a child can be counted for a minyan. The Rif doesn't count this statement. The Ramban (Milchamot 35b) explains that the Rif held it wasn't accepted since the gemara on 48a says we don't follow any of the earlier statements on the topic of minyan and zimmun. Ravyah (cited by Mordechai Brachot 172), Rambam Tefillah 8:4, and Rashba Brachot 48a s.v. veleyt agree. However, Tosfot 48a s.v. veleyt quotes Rabbenu Tam who held that Rabbi Yehoshua Ben Levi was never rejected. The Ri disagreed and adds that Rabbenu Tam himself never followed his opinion in practice. Rosh Brachot 7:20 and Mordechai Brachot 172 quote the dispute of Rabbenu Tam and Ri and add that Rav Hai Goan agreed with Rabbenu Tam. Baal Hameor Brachot 35b agrees with Rabbenu Tam. (Raavad on Rif implies he disagrees with the Raavad.) | # A child can't be counted for a minyan. There is an opinion who allows counting a child for the tenth person if there's nine other adults. Ashkenazim can rely on that upon in an extenuating circumstance.<ref> Rabbi Yehoshua Ben Levi (Brachot 47b) said that a child can be counted for a minyan. The Rif doesn't count this statement. The Ramban (Milchamot 35b) explains that the Rif held it wasn't accepted since the gemara on 48a says we don't follow any of the earlier statements on the topic of minyan and zimmun. Ravyah (cited by Mordechai Brachot 172), Rambam Tefillah 8:4, and Rashba Brachot 48a s.v. veleyt agree. However, Tosfot 48a s.v. veleyt quotes Rabbenu Tam who held that Rabbi Yehoshua Ben Levi was never rejected. The Ri disagreed and adds that Rabbenu Tam himself never followed his opinion in practice. Rosh Brachot 7:20 and Mordechai Brachot 172 quote the dispute of Rabbenu Tam and Ri and add that Rav Hai Goan agreed with Rabbenu Tam. Baal Hameor Brachot 35b agrees with Rabbenu Tam. (Raavad on Rif implies he disagrees with the Raavad.) | ||
* Orchot Chaim (Tefillah 73) records a story in which the Rabbenu Shimshon put a town in excommunication for disobeying his ruling and | * Orchot Chaim (Tefillah 73) records a story in which the Rabbenu Shimshon put a town in excommunication for disobeying his ruling and counted a child for a minyan. On the the opposite extreme the Kolbo ch. 11 at the end writes that the minhag of all of Yisrael is to count a child for a minyan. Bet Yosef 55:4 writes that this is an exaggeration. | ||
* Tosfot s.v. veleyt writes that even according to Rabbenu Tam you can only count one child and not multiple children. However, the Baal Hameor suggests that you can even count up to four children as long as there's six adults. Mordechai Brachot 172. Magen Avraham 55:5 writes that even in extenuating circumstances we only follow Rabbenu Tam and not the Baal Hameor. Mishna Brurah 55:24 agrees. | * Tosfot s.v. veleyt writes that even according to Rabbenu Tam you can only count one child and not multiple children. However, the Baal Hameor suggests that you can even count up to four children as long as there's six adults. Mordechai Brachot 172. Magen Avraham 55:5 writes that even in extenuating circumstances we only follow Rabbenu Tam and not the Baal Hameor. Mishna Brurah 55:24 agrees. | ||
* Tosfot writes that there's no advantage of having the child hold a sefer torah because a sefer torah isn't a person and doesn't add anything for a minyan. The Rama 55:4 writes that those who counted a child for a minyan didn't have them hold a sefer torah. Magen Avraham 55:4 writes that in his day the minhag was to count a child specifically holding a sefer torah. | * Tosfot writes that there's no advantage of having the child hold a sefer torah because a sefer torah isn't a person and doesn't add anything for a minyan. The Rama 55:4 writes that those who counted a child for a minyan didn't have them hold a sefer torah. Magen Avraham 55:4 writes that in his day the minhag was to count a child specifically holding a sefer torah. | ||
