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Davening with a Minyan: Difference between revisions
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→Conditions to do Chazarat Hashatz
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==Conditions to do Chazarat Hashatz== | ==Conditions to do Chazarat Hashatz== | ||
# If ten individuals davened separately and then joined together afterwards most poskim hold that they can not recite chazrat hashatz since they didn't daven together btzibbur.<ref>Shulchan Aruch O.C. 69:1 holds that they can recite chazarat hashatz even if ten people davened separately and now joined together. However, the Mishna Brurah 69:1 follows the Radvaz and Magen Avraham 69:4 who argue that since they each davened separately there is no way for them to join together afterwards to create a tzibur that is obligated and able to recite chazarat hashatz. See Kaf Hachayim on Shulchan Arukh, Orach Chayim 69:7 who accepts Shulchan Aruch. Tzitz Eliezer 14:6 and Har Tzvi 1:51 accept the Mishna Brurah.</ref> | # If ten individuals davened separately and then joined together afterwards most poskim hold that they can not recite chazrat hashatz since they didn't daven together btzibbur.<ref>Shulchan Aruch O.C. 69:1 holds that they can recite chazarat hashatz even if ten people davened separately and now joined together. However, the Mishna Brurah 69:1 follows the Radvaz and Magen Avraham 69:4 who argue that since they each davened separately there is no way for them to join together afterwards to create a tzibur that is obligated and able to recite chazarat hashatz. See Kaf Hachayim on Shulchan Arukh, Orach Chayim 69:7 who accepts Shulchan Aruch. Tzitz Eliezer 14:6 and Har Tzvi 1:51 accept the Mishna Brurah. Imrei Yosher 2:9 writes that a person has what to rely upon Chatom Sofer who accepts Shulchan Aruch with respect to Kedusha but not Kaddish.</ref> | ||
# If nine people davening Shemona Esrei together and afterwards one person entered they can not recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Tzitz Eliezer 14:6. This fits with the approach of Mishna Brurah 69:1 based on Radvaz.</ref> | # If nine people davening Shemona Esrei together and afterwards one person entered they can not recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Tzitz Eliezer 14:6. This fits with the approach of Mishna Brurah 69:1 based on Radvaz.</ref> | ||
# If there were ten people in the room and six were davening and four were not, they can nonetheless recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Mishna Brurah 69:8 based on Magen Avraham</ref> | # If there were ten people in the room and six were davening and four were not, they can nonetheless recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Mishna Brurah 69:8 based on Magen Avraham</ref> | ||
##Even if these six who davened Shemona Esrei started and finished at different times but all overlapped at some point they can recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 citing Minchat Elazar 2:77 and Chelek Levi 45</ref> | ##Even if these six who davened Shemona Esrei started and finished at different times but all overlapped at some point they can recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 citing Minchat Elazar 2:77 and Chelek Levi 45</ref> | ||
##Even if these four people who were not davening some of them left while the six were davening Shemona Esrei and returned or others returned they can still recite chazarat hashatz.< | ##Even if these four people who were not davening some of them left while the six were davening Shemona Esrei and returned or others returned they can still recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 citing Keren Ldovid 16. He explains that since the six started shemona esrei at the same time when 10 people were in the room they were obligated in chazarat hashatz even if someone people left in the middle and came back or were replaced.</ref> | ||
##If some of those six people didn't finish Shemona Esrei but there are nine people who can answer amen to the shaliach tzibbur they can start the chazarat hashatz without further delay.<ref>Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 citing Minchat Yitzchak 1:57</ref> | ##If some of those six people didn't finish Shemona Esrei, but there are nine people who can answer amen to the shaliach tzibbur they can start the chazarat hashatz without further delay.<ref>Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 citing Minchat Yitzchak 1:57. Keren Ldovid 16 would also permit this.</ref> | ||
## If one of those six people made a mistake by omitting something that they had to because of the day such as Yaaleh Vyavo on Rosh Chodesh and need to repeat Shemona Esrei nonetheless they can recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 citing Eretz Tzvi 1:39</reF> | ## If one of those six people made a mistake by omitting something that they had to because of the day such as Yaaleh Vyavo on Rosh Chodesh and need to repeat Shemona Esrei nonetheless they can recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 citing Eretz Tzvi 1:39</reF> | ||
# If there were ten people in the room and only five or fewer were davening they can not recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Biur Halacha 69:1 leaves this question unresolved whether according to the Radvaz they are allowed to do chazart hashatz. Tzitz Eliezer 14:6 concludes that they should not do chazarat hashatz.</ref> Others hold that they can.<ref>Rav Meir Arik in Imrei Yosher 2:9 holds that although they may not get into this situation initially and should daven in a proper minyan and hear chazarata hashatz. However, after the fact they can and should recite chazarat hashatz in order to hear kedusha. Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 follows this Imrei Yoshar and quotes others who agree including Tehillah Ldovid 69:2, Minchat Yitzchak 1:57, and Afarsekta Daniya 2:16. Har Tzvi 1:51 based on Maharam Shik 44 and Tzitz Eliezer 14:6 who do not accept this distinction.</ref> The same is true if there were ten people in the room and five davened together and one davens his silent shemona esrei together with the chazarat hashatz aloud that is subject to the above debate if they can do chazarat hashatz.<ref>Imrei Yoshar 2:9</ref> | # If there were ten people in the room and only five or fewer were davening they can not recite chazarat hashatz.<ref>Biur Halacha 69:1 leaves this question unresolved whether according to the Radvaz they are allowed to do chazart hashatz. Tzitz Eliezer 14:6 concludes that they should not do chazarat hashatz.</ref> Others hold that they can.<ref>Rav Meir Arik in Imrei Yosher 2:9 holds that although they may not get into this situation initially and should daven in a proper minyan and hear chazarata hashatz. However, after the fact they can and should recite chazarat hashatz in order to hear kedusha. Piskei Teshuvot 69:1 follows this Imrei Yoshar and quotes others who agree including Tehillah Ldovid 69:2, Minchat Yitzchak 1:57, and Afarsekta Daniya 2:16. Har Tzvi 1:51 based on Maharam Shik 44 and Tzitz Eliezer 14:6 who do not accept this distinction.</ref> The same is true if there were ten people in the room and five davened together and one davens his silent shemona esrei together with the chazarat hashatz aloud that is subject to the above debate if they can do chazarat hashatz.<ref>Imrei Yoshar 2:9</ref> | ||
