Shomea KeOneh: Difference between revisions
From Halachipedia
m
Text replacement - " Biblical" to " biblical"
m (Text replacement - " Biblical" to " biblical") Tags: Mobile edit Mobile web edit |
|||
| Line 30: | Line 30: | ||
# The Yerushalmi (Brachot 3:3) establishes that for everything one can fulfill the obligation of someone else with the exception of Shemona Esrei, Shema, and Birkat Hamazon. | # The Yerushalmi (Brachot 3:3) establishes that for everything one can fulfill the obligation of someone else with the exception of Shemona Esrei, Shema, and Birkat Hamazon. | ||
# Someone who is obligated in a mitzvah can fulfill the obligation of someone else who is also obligated in that mitzvah. Someone who is exempt can't exempt someone who is obligated in the mitzvah.<Ref>Rosh Hashana 29a, Brachot 20b, Rambam Brachot 1:11</ref> | # Someone who is obligated in a mitzvah can fulfill the obligation of someone else who is also obligated in that mitzvah. Someone who is exempt can't exempt someone who is obligated in the mitzvah.<Ref>Rosh Hashana 29a, Brachot 20b, Rambam Brachot 1:11</ref> | ||
# Someone who is obligated in a mitzvah on a rabbinic level can't fulfill the obligation of someone who is obligated on a | # Someone who is obligated in a mitzvah on a rabbinic level can't fulfill the obligation of someone who is obligated on a biblical level.<ref>Brachot 20b. Rashi Brachot 48a s.v. ad writes that once a person is obligated in a mitzvah rabbinically he can fulfill the obligation of someone who is obligated biblically. That point is disputed by the Bahag cited by Rashi, Tosfot 48a s.v. ad, Rosh Brachot 7:21, Rambam Brachot 1:11, Rabbenu Yonah Brachot 35b umha, and Rashba 48a s.v. yahavu. According to Tosfot, the fact that you need to eat in order to say Birkat Hamazon isn't a perfect example of something you need to be obligated in in order to fulfill others since biblically you could say Birkat Hamazon without eating at all based on Yatzah Motzei. However, the Mordechai (Megillah n. 798) implies that it is permitted to do so and his proof is that we recite Kiddush during Tosefet Shabbat and fulfill Kiddush for Shabbat biblically.</ref> | ||
# Someone who is obligated in a rabbinic mitzvah on a rabbinic level can fulfill the obligation of someone who is completely obligated in that rabbinic mitzvah.<ref>Tosfot Megillah 19b writes that a child which is obligated in megillah on a rabbinic level can't fulfill the obligation of an adult in megillah which is only a rabbinic mitzvah because a double derabbanan can't fulfill the obligation of a single derabbanan. Rabbi Akiva Eiger Brachot 20b s.v. elah points out that a child who ate a kezayit can fulfill the obligation of an adult who ate a kezayit even though the child is a double derabbanan and the adult is a simple derabbanan since birkat hamazon is different and even if you didn't eat at all | # Someone who is obligated in a rabbinic mitzvah on a rabbinic level can fulfill the obligation of someone who is completely obligated in that rabbinic mitzvah.<ref>Tosfot Megillah 19b writes that a child which is obligated in megillah on a rabbinic level can't fulfill the obligation of an adult in megillah which is only a rabbinic mitzvah because a double derabbanan can't fulfill the obligation of a single derabbanan. Rabbi Akiva Eiger Brachot 20b s.v. elah points out that a child who ate a kezayit can fulfill the obligation of an adult who ate a kezayit even though the child is a double derabbanan and the adult is a simple derabbanan since birkat hamazon is different and even if you didn't eat at all biblically you can fulfill the obligation of others.</ref> | ||
# Some say that if everyone listening to the bracha knows how to recite the bracha themselves they shouldn't use yatzah motzei.<ref>Shulchan Aruch 273:4 writes that one should only say kiddush for others if they already fulfilled their obligation if the others don't know how to say kiddush. Pri Chadash 273:4 disagrees but adds that if those listening answer amen it works even according to Shulchan Aruch. Biur Halacha 273:4 s.v. vhu writes that it is purely a mitzvah that since the one listening knows how to say it and they are going to fulfill their obligation they should be the one to say it but certainly after the fact they fulfill their obligation.</ref> | # Some say that if everyone listening to the bracha knows how to recite the bracha themselves they shouldn't use yatzah motzei.<ref>Shulchan Aruch 273:4 writes that one should only say kiddush for others if they already fulfilled their obligation if the others don't know how to say kiddush. Pri Chadash 273:4 disagrees but adds that if those listening answer amen it works even according to Shulchan Aruch. Biur Halacha 273:4 s.v. vhu writes that it is purely a mitzvah that since the one listening knows how to say it and they are going to fulfill their obligation they should be the one to say it but certainly after the fact they fulfill their obligation.</ref> | ||
===Yatzah Motzei=== | ===Yatzah Motzei=== | ||
# If a person already fulfilled his obligation he can nonetheless fulfill the obligation of others based on the concept that all Jews are responsible for one another. That concept is called Yatzah Motzei.<ref>Rosh Hashana 29a, Shulchan Aruch 273:4</ref> This concept works for | # If a person already fulfilled his obligation he can nonetheless fulfill the obligation of others based on the concept that all Jews are responsible for one another. That concept is called Yatzah Motzei.<ref>Rosh Hashana 29a, Shulchan Aruch 273:4</ref> This concept works for biblical and rabbinic mitzvot.<ref>Even though the Turei Even Rosh Hashana 29b holds that it is only effective on rabbinic mitzvot, we don't accept his opinion (Minchat Shlomo 1:3). Also, even though the Tzlach Brachot 48a holds that it is only effective on biblical mitzvot, we don't accept his opinion (Meor Yisrael Brachot 48a s.v. maan). The Rif Pesachim 27a and Rosh Pesachim 10:36 write that it is possible to have yatzah motzei for maror even though maror today is rabbinic. Shulchan Aruch 484:1 codifies the Rif and Rosh. Meor Yisrael cites the Birkei Yosef 124:3, Imrei Binah Shabbat n. 11, and Chatan Sofer 129 who assume not like the Tzlach. Ritva Hilchot Brachot 2:24 seems to be a proof for the Tzlach. | ||
* Zera Avraham 1:12 writes that there's no such thing as arvut on mitzvot derabbanan since we only entered the convert of responsibility for all Jews on the mitzvot we had at the time of Har Grizim and Avel and not mitzvot derabbanan. Ginat Veradim 1:13 assumed otherwise. The Birkei Yosef 124:3 proves that it applies to derabbanan's as well from Rashi Rosh Hashana 29a who says that avrut should have applied to all brachot hanehenin but it doesn't since one isn't obligated to eat. The Ran and Tashbetz 3:79 agree. Since birchat hanehenin are derabbanan, it is clear that arvut applies to derabbanan's. He repeats this in Chaim Shaal 1:75 and adds that Tosfot Brachot 48a also holds that arvut applies to derabbanan mitzvot.</ref> | * Zera Avraham 1:12 writes that there's no such thing as arvut on mitzvot derabbanan since we only entered the convert of responsibility for all Jews on the mitzvot we had at the time of Har Grizim and Avel and not mitzvot derabbanan. Ginat Veradim 1:13 assumed otherwise. The Birkei Yosef 124:3 proves that it applies to derabbanan's as well from Rashi Rosh Hashana 29a who says that avrut should have applied to all brachot hanehenin but it doesn't since one isn't obligated to eat. The Ran and Tashbetz 3:79 agree. Since birchat hanehenin are derabbanan, it is clear that arvut applies to derabbanan's. He repeats this in Chaim Shaal 1:75 and adds that Tosfot Brachot 48a also holds that arvut applies to derabbanan mitzvot.</ref> | ||
# Regarding [[Brachot]] HaMitzvah, even if one has already fulfilled one’s obligation one can still fulfill the obligation of others because of the principle of Aravim Zeh BaZeh, the responsibility for our fellow Jew. <Ref> Mishna Brurah 213:14 </ref> | # Regarding [[Brachot]] HaMitzvah, even if one has already fulfilled one’s obligation one can still fulfill the obligation of others because of the principle of Aravim Zeh BaZeh, the responsibility for our fellow Jew. <Ref> Mishna Brurah 213:14 </ref> | ||
| Line 49: | Line 49: | ||
===If One Isn't Currently Obligated=== | ===If One Isn't Currently Obligated=== | ||
# Someone who isn't obligated in Megillah that day can't fulfill the obligation of someone who is obligated that day.<ref>Yerushalmi 2:3 writes that someone from outside Yerushalayim can’t fulfill the obligation of someone who lives in Yerushalayim on the 15th. The gemara has a question about the opposite case. Tosfot Yevamot 14a s.v. ki holds that someone obligated one day can’t fulfill the obligation of someone obligated another day. Rosh Yevamot 1:9 and Ran 2b s.v. vyesh agree. However, Rashi Megillah 2a s.v. elah that someone from a city can read the megillah before the 14th for the small villages.</ref> | # Someone who isn't obligated in Megillah that day can't fulfill the obligation of someone who is obligated that day.<ref>Yerushalmi 2:3 writes that someone from outside Yerushalayim can’t fulfill the obligation of someone who lives in Yerushalayim on the 15th. The gemara has a question about the opposite case. Tosfot Yevamot 14a s.v. ki holds that someone obligated one day can’t fulfill the obligation of someone obligated another day. Rosh Yevamot 1:9 and Ran 2b s.v. vyesh agree. However, Rashi Megillah 2a s.v. elah that someone from a city can read the megillah before the 14th for the small villages.</ref> | ||
# In an extenuating circumstance it is permitted to recite kiddush for someone who accepted Shabbat even though the one didn’t accept Shabbat and plans to do melacha afterwards. One may not use this leniency on a regular basis.<ref>Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach in Minchat Shlomo 1:3 writes that it is permitted on a temporary basis for someone to recite kiddush for someone else who accepted Shabbat and for the one making kiddush not to accept Shabbat. He explains that | # In an extenuating circumstance it is permitted to recite kiddush for someone who accepted Shabbat even though the one didn’t accept Shabbat and plans to do melacha afterwards. One may not use this leniency on a regular basis.<ref>Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach in Minchat Shlomo 1:3 writes that it is permitted on a temporary basis for someone to recite kiddush for someone else who accepted Shabbat and for the one making kiddush not to accept Shabbat. He explains that biblically one can fulfill his obligation even if one isn’t obligated in that mitzvah right now (relevant to someone who lives in Yerushalayim fulfilling the obligation of someone outside Yerushalayim on the 14th of Adar). Also, according to the Rambam it is sufficient to say Kiddush close to Shabbat even though it isn’t Shabbat right now. However, since Rabbi Akiva Eiger isn’t sure about it and there are reasons to question whether it is possible to say kiddush without accepting Shabbat, one shouldn’t rely on this leniency consistently or create a minhag with it. [https://www.torahanytime.com/#/lectures?v=74381 Rav Yitzchak Yosef (Motzei Shabbat Shemot 5779 min 43)] and Tzitz Eliezer 14:25 were lenient.</ref> | ||
# Some held that if a person forgot to count the sefira one night it is permitted to recite the bracha for someone else who did count every night, but others disagree.<ref>Har Tzvi 2:75 quotes that the Bet Halevi once forgot to count sefirat haomer one night and when he was shaliach tzibur he asked someone to listen to his bracha with intent to fulfill his obligation. The Har Tzvi points out that the Knesset Hagedola and Pri Chadash Pri Chadash 489:8 argue that it is impossible for someone who didn’t count one night to fulfill the obligation of someone who counted every night since the one who forgot once is like he isn’t obligated in the mitzvah any more. They compare it to the case of someone who lives in Yerushalayim fulfilling the obligation of megillah for someone outside Yerushalayim on the 14th of Adar. Har Tzvi defends the Bet Halevi. Chashukei Chemed Niddah 73a is strict.</ref> | # Some held that if a person forgot to count the sefira one night it is permitted to recite the bracha for someone else who did count every night, but others disagree.<ref>Har Tzvi 2:75 quotes that the Bet Halevi once forgot to count sefirat haomer one night and when he was shaliach tzibur he asked someone to listen to his bracha with intent to fulfill his obligation. The Har Tzvi points out that the Knesset Hagedola and Pri Chadash Pri Chadash 489:8 argue that it is impossible for someone who didn’t count one night to fulfill the obligation of someone who counted every night since the one who forgot once is like he isn’t obligated in the mitzvah any more. They compare it to the case of someone who lives in Yerushalayim fulfilling the obligation of megillah for someone outside Yerushalayim on the 14th of Adar. Har Tzvi defends the Bet Halevi. Chashukei Chemed Niddah 73a is strict.</ref> | ||
# See [[Yom Tov Sheni]] for an Israeli fulfilling the obligation of an American in Kiddush on the second day of Yom Tov. | # See [[Yom Tov Sheni]] for an Israeli fulfilling the obligation of an American in Kiddush on the second day of Yom Tov. | ||
