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Kiddush: Difference between revisions
From Halachipedia
→If there is no wine or grape juice
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# If one doesn't have wine on Friday night, kiddush should be recited on the bread and one should keep one's hands on the bread throughout the kiddush. <ref> Shulchan Aruch 272:9 writes that some say one should say kiddush on chamar medina, some say not to say kiddush at all, and some who say that bread should be used for kiddush because of its importance. Rama 279:2 comments that the minhag is like the last opinion. Kaf HaChayim 272:50 and Yalkut Yosef 272:16 write that Shulchan Aruch holds like the last opinion. Mishnah Brurah 272:28 says to put your hands on the [[challah]]. Rav Avigdor Neventzahl in his commentary on Mishna Brurah (Biyitzchak Yikare 272:28) says that one should actually hold the [[challah]]. </ref> | # If one doesn't have wine on Friday night, kiddush should be recited on the bread and one should keep one's hands on the bread throughout the kiddush. <ref> Shulchan Aruch 272:9 writes that some say one should say kiddush on chamar medina, some say not to say kiddush at all, and some who say that bread should be used for kiddush because of its importance. Rama 279:2 comments that the minhag is like the last opinion. Kaf HaChayim 272:50 and Yalkut Yosef 272:16 write that Shulchan Aruch holds like the last opinion. Mishnah Brurah 272:28 says to put your hands on the [[challah]]. Rav Avigdor Neventzahl in his commentary on Mishna Brurah (Biyitzchak Yikare 272:28) says that one should actually hold the [[challah]]. </ref> | ||
# If there's no wine available for [[Shabbat]] lunch one should use Chamar Medina for kiddush. If one doesn't even have Chamar Medina, one should just say hamotzi and eat the bread, and if he doesn't even have bread one may eat without [[Kiddish]]. <ref> Shulchan Aruch 289:2, Mishna Brurah 289:10. The logic behind not using bread for [[kiddish]] during the day is explained by Mishna Brurah 272:31 that if one were to recite the daytime [[kiddish]] over bread, it would be the same procedure as if he wasn't saying kiddush at all. Therefore, to make it apparent that we are saying [[kiddish]] also, we say a beracha that wouldn't normally be recited, even if that is a [[shehakol]]. As for the definition of chamar medina Mishnah Brurah 272:24 says that even beer is only permitted in a place where it is a common drink. Mishna Brurah 272:25 prohibits the use of milk or oil, and Mishna Brurah 272:30 permits the use of liquor. Rav Avigdor Neventzahl in Biyitzchak Yikare footnote 25 says that according to Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach milk is not allowed even in places where it is commonly used like Switzerland. He also says that juice, tea, or coffee maybe permitted but soda is definitely not because it is just like water. Rav Moshe Feinstein in Iggerot Moshe OC 2:75 defines chamar medina as something you would serve to guests who you want to show respect to. Also see [[Shevet Halevi]] 3:26 and 5:32 where Rav Vosner says even where you have wine, chamar medina can be used because in the times of the gemara, wine was far more widespread. Today however, most people do not drink wine so often so other drinks are not inferior to wine for [[kiddish]]. </ref> | # If there's no wine available for [[Shabbat]] lunch one should use Chamar Medina for kiddush. If one doesn't even have Chamar Medina, one should just say hamotzi and eat the bread, and if he doesn't even have bread one may eat without [[Kiddish]]. <ref> Shulchan Aruch 289:2, Mishna Brurah 289:10. The logic behind not using bread for [[kiddish]] during the day is explained by Mishna Brurah 272:31 that if one were to recite the daytime [[kiddish]] over bread, it would be the same procedure as if he wasn't saying kiddush at all. Therefore, to make it apparent that we are saying [[kiddish]] also, we say a beracha that wouldn't normally be recited, even if that is a [[shehakol]]. As for the definition of chamar medina Mishnah Brurah 272:24 says that even beer is only permitted in a place where it is a common drink. Mishna Brurah 272:25 prohibits the use of milk or oil, and Mishna Brurah 272:30 permits the use of liquor. Rav Avigdor Neventzahl in Biyitzchak Yikare footnote 25 says that according to Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach milk is not allowed even in places where it is commonly used like Switzerland. He also says that juice, tea, or coffee maybe permitted but soda is definitely not because it is just like water. Rav Moshe Feinstein in Iggerot Moshe OC 2:75 defines chamar medina as something you would serve to guests who you want to show respect to. Also see [[Shevet Halevi]] 3:26 and 5:32 where Rav Vosner says even where you have wine, chamar medina can be used because in the times of the gemara, wine was far more widespread. Today however, most people do not drink wine so often so other drinks are not inferior to wine for [[kiddish]]. </ref> | ||
# According to Sephardim, one should only use Chamar Medina for [[Shabbat]] lunch if the wine isn't available in the city | # According to Sephardim, one should only use Chamar Medina for [[Shabbat]] lunch if the wine isn't available in the city and chamar medina is a popular drink in that city. <ref> Chazon Ovadia, Hilchot Shabbat, Chelek 2, Page 124 </ref> If chamar medina is just expensive then one should use wine. <ref>Yalkut Yosef ([[Shabbat]], vol 1, pg 289) </ref> According to Ashkenazim, if the wine is expensive one may use Chamar Medina for the daytime [[Kiddish]] and one who uses wine is fulfilling a preferred mitzvah. <Ref>Mishna Brurah 272:29 </ref> | ||
# One may not use soda for [[Kiddish]] because soda isn't considered Chamar Medina.<ref>Sh"t Igrot Moshe 2:75 rules that soda is just like water and can not be used for [[Kiddish]].</ref> | # One may not use soda for [[Kiddish]] because soda isn't considered Chamar Medina.<ref>Sh"t Igrot Moshe 2:75 rules that soda is just like water and can not be used for [[Kiddish]].</ref> | ||
