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Counting Jewish People: Difference between revisions

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==Background of the issue==
==Background of the issue==
The first source which introduces the prohibition of counting Jewish people is from the פסוק in Ki Tisa כי תשא את ראש בני ישראל לפקדיהם ונתנו איש כפר נפשו ליהוה בפקד אתם ולא יהיה בהם נגף בפקד אתם: Rashi writes that the פסוק implies that the count incurs the Ayin Hara rather they should give half shekels in order to be counted and in this way they’ll be spared from a plague. According to this understanding of the פסוק there’s a general prohibition to count Jews directly and there’s also a danger of incurring a plague.  
The first source which introduces the prohibition of counting Jewish people is from the פסוק in Ki Tisa כי תשא את ראש בני ישראל לפקדיהם ונתנו איש כפר נפשו ליהוה בפקד אתם ולא יהיה בהם נגף בפקד אתם: Rashi writes that the פסוק implies that the count incurs the Ayin Hara rather they should give half shekels in order to be counted and in this way they’ll be spared from a plague. According to this understanding of the פסוק there’s a general prohibition to count Jews directly and there’s also a danger of incurring a plague.  
However, the Mishna Yoma 22b writes that when the officer in charge of appointing specific Cohanim to the jobs in that day’s service in the Bet HaMidash, the officer would pick a high number, each cohen would put out one or two fingers and then the officer would count the fingers until he reached the number he picked. The Gemara explains that they didn’t count the heads of the Cohanim because it’s prohibited to count Jews even for the purpose of a mitzvah and proves it from a פסוק by Shaul HaMelech who counted the people for the army through sheep (he gave each person a sheep and then collected the sheep and counted them). Then the Gemara goes on to quote two other pesukim in Nach to prove the prohibition to count Jews.  
However, the Mishna Yoma 22b writes that when the officer in charge of appointing specific Cohanim to the jobs in that day’s service in the Bet HaMidash, the officer would pick a high number, each cohen would put out one or two fingers and then the officer would count the fingers until he reached the number he picked. The Gemara explains that they didn’t count the heads of the Cohanim because it’s prohibited to count Jews even for the purpose of a mitzvah and proves it from a פסוק by Shaul HaMelech who counted the people for the army through sheep (he gave each person a sheep and then collected the sheep and counted them). Then the Gemara goes on to quote two other pesukim in Nach to prove the prohibition to count Jews.  
[Some explain that the reason it was permitted to count fingers and not heads is because when counting heads one is certain to come to a precise total while when counting fingers one is uncertain whether one will actually know the number of Jews considering that some put out two fingers and some only one. On the other hand some said that counting any part of a person that’s not totally an essential part of the body (finger) is like not counting a Jew directly. (Sh”t Igrot Moshe Y”D 2:117(2).)]
[Some explain that the reason it was permitted to count fingers and not heads is because when counting heads one is certain to come to a precise total while when counting fingers one is uncertain whether one will actually know the number of Jews considering that some put out two fingers and some only one. On the other hand some said that counting any part of a person that’s not totally an essential part of the body (finger) is like not counting a Jew directly. (Sh”t Igrot Moshe Y”D 2:117(2).)]
The question asked is that why didn’t the Gemara quote the פסוק in Ki Tisa which would be a biblical source instead of quoting from Neviyim. Some answer that it was possible to think that the reason the half shekelim were collected was in collect to atone for the Chet HaEgel really counting directly was permitted, therefore the Gemara brings a source in Nach to prove the prohibition (Maharsha Yoma). Alternatively some answer that perhaps Moshe counted them directly and the coins were given to remove the Ayin Harah but there’s no proof to the actual prohibition and so the Gemara quoted the pesukim by shaul (Makom Shmuel). However, some answered that really there is a prohibition from the פסוק in Ki Tisa but the Gemara wanted to prove that it was prohibited even for mitzvah purposes and the count in Ki Tisa wasn’t for mitzvah purposes. The implication of this is that the count done by Moshe wasn’t for a mitzvah but nonetheless was permitted by means of counting something besides the actual people (Tzitz Eliezer 7:3:1, Divrei Emet). Yet, this last point is disputed and some rejected this leniency saying that if this were true then why didn’t Yoav (David’s general who carried out the count) collect something from each Jews and then count that, rather it must be that there’s no leniency to count by means of something else except for the purposes of a mitzvah (Bear Sheva).  
The question asked is that why didn’t the Gemara quote the פסוק in Ki Tisa which would be a biblical source instead of quoting from Neviyim. Some answer that it was possible to think that the reason the half shekelim were collected was in collect to atone for the Chet HaEgel really counting directly was permitted, therefore the Gemara brings a source in Nach to prove the prohibition (Maharsha Yoma). Alternatively some answer that perhaps Moshe counted them directly and the coins were given to remove the Ayin Harah but there’s no proof to the actual prohibition and so the Gemara quoted the pesukim by shaul (Makom Shmuel). However, some answered that really there is a prohibition from the פסוק in Ki Tisa but the Gemara wanted to prove that it was prohibited even for mitzvah purposes and the count in Ki Tisa wasn’t for mitzvah purposes. The implication of this is that the count done by Moshe wasn’t for a mitzvah but nonetheless was permitted by means of counting something besides the actual people (Tzitz Eliezer 7:3:1, Divrei Emet). Yet, this last point is disputed and some rejected this leniency saying that if this were true then why didn’t Yoav (David’s general who carried out the count) collect something from each Jews and then count that, rather it must be that there’s no leniency to count by means of something else except for the purposes of a mitzvah (Bear Sheva).  
Nonetheless, there is an explicit Gemara Brachot 62 which says that after David sinned, Hashem said that he would make David falter even on something so simple every schoolchild would know and so it happened that David counted the Jews and there was a plague. Interestingly that Gemara quotes the פסוק in Ki Tisa and comments that it was something that everyone knew, seemingly implying that it’s a bona fide prohibition. Based on this understanding of the פסוק in Ki Tisa there’s a question as to why the Rishonim who listed all 613 מצות didn’t count this one. Some drew from this that actually the entire prohibition was Derabbanan (Rashbetz) while others answered that it wasn’t counted because it wasn’t explicit in the Torah and it’s only a negative command implied from a positive one which isn’t usually counted amongst the 613 (Divrei Emet).  
Nonetheless, there is an explicit Gemara Brachot 62 which says that after David sinned, Hashem said that he would make David falter even on something so simple every schoolchild would know and so it happened that David counted the Jews and there was a plague. Interestingly that Gemara quotes the פסוק in Ki Tisa and comments that it was something that everyone knew, seemingly implying that it’s a bona fide prohibition. Based on this understanding of the פסוק in Ki Tisa there’s a question as to why the Rishonim who listed all 613 מצות didn’t count this one. Some drew from this that actually the entire prohibition was Derabbanan (Rashbetz) while others answered that it wasn’t counted because it wasn’t explicit in the Torah and it’s only a negative command implied from a positive one which isn’t usually counted amongst the 613 (Divrei Emet).  


There’s numerous discussions on this halachic topic drawing on all different types of sources and logic. Two more points is that this discussion reemerged when European countries began to take public censuses. It was discussed at length at the time with the חתם סופר coming out strict that one shouldn’t participate while the Peot HaShulchan concluding leniently. Since then there has been a tremendous discussion every time the Israeli census takes place, some of the Gedolim permitting while others advising people from refraining.  
There’s numerous discussions on this halachic topic drawing on all different types of sources and logic. Two more points is that this discussion reemerged when European countries began to take public censuses. It was discussed at length at the time with the חתם סופר coming out strict that one shouldn’t participate while the Peot HaShulchan concluding leniently. Since then there has been a tremendous discussion every time the Israeli census takes place, some of the Gedolim permitting while others advising people from refraining.