Corporations and Partnerships with Respect to Ribbit: Difference between revisions
From Halachipedia
Corporations and Partnerships with Respect to Ribbit (view source)
Revision as of 19:53, 16 June 2020
, 16 June 2020→Wages for an Iska Worker
| Line 29: | Line 29: | ||
# In the above example, if the worker was given a stipulation under which he would keep 2/3 of the gains and only assumed 1/2 of the losses, then it would be permitted. So, when he gained $10 he would return $103.3 and when he would lose $10 he would return $95. Alternatively, they could have arranged that the worker would keep 1/2 of the gains and only assume 1/3 of the losses. For our example, when the worker would gain $10 he would have to return $105 but in the case of a $10 he would return $93.3.<ref>Gemara Bava Metsia 68b-69a</ref> We hold that this arrangement is effective with any percentages as long as the amount that the worker stands to gain is greater than the amount he stands to lose.<ref>These stipulations are those of the Gemara Bava Metsia 68b as understood by the Raavad Sheluchin 6:3, Tur 177:4, Shach 177:14, Taz 177:8, and Chelkat Binyamin 177:70. This can be followed even if not stipulated in advance. However, once it is stipulated in advance it is sufficient to give the worker even a small increase (Shulchan Aruch 177:3, Chelkat Binyamin 177:162).</ref> | # In the above example, if the worker was given a stipulation under which he would keep 2/3 of the gains and only assumed 1/2 of the losses, then it would be permitted. So, when he gained $10 he would return $103.3 and when he would lose $10 he would return $95. Alternatively, they could have arranged that the worker would keep 1/2 of the gains and only assume 1/3 of the losses. For our example, when the worker would gain $10 he would have to return $105 but in the case of a $10 he would return $93.3.<ref>Gemara Bava Metsia 68b-69a</ref> We hold that this arrangement is effective with any percentages as long as the amount that the worker stands to gain is greater than the amount he stands to lose.<ref>These stipulations are those of the Gemara Bava Metsia 68b as understood by the Raavad Sheluchin 6:3, Tur 177:4, Shach 177:14, Taz 177:8, and Chelkat Binyamin 177:70. This can be followed even if not stipulated in advance. However, once it is stipulated in advance it is sufficient to give the worker even a small increase (Shulchan Aruch 177:3, Chelkat Binyamin 177:162).</ref> | ||
====Wages for an Iska Worker==== | ====Wages for an Iska Worker==== | ||
# If they stipulate in advance it is sufficient to pay the iska agent a small wage.<ref>Shulchan Aruch Y.D. 177:3</ref> Some hold that any amount above a [[pruta]] is sufficient, while others hold that it is a [[dinar]], which is closer to $3.<ref>Chelkat Binyamin 177:55 cits that the Birkei Yosef holds that a dinar is necessary while the Prisha, Bet Meir, and Chavot Daat think that it could be less than a dinar.</ref> Some say that it must be an amount that is recognizably a wage and not a token payment.<ref>Bet Yosef 177:2 citing Smag, Chelkat Binyamin 177:55 citing Darkei Teshuva from Bet Dovid</ref> The common practice is to give $1.<ref>Igrot Moshe 3:39, Chelkat Binyamin 177:55, [http://bethdin.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/ShtarIska.pdf Heter Iska of the Bet Din of America], [https://www.star-k.org/images/db//hetter-iska.pdf Heter Iska of Star-K]</ref> | |||
# Some say that if there's a benefit that the agent has in fact that because he has more money from the iska it isn't necessary to pay him. That is, an iska is essentially a part loan and part investment and the part that is a loan belongs to the agent. If the agent would not have been able to invest his loan loan without the extra money of the investment part, such as with half of the money he doesn't meet a certain type of investment vehicle threshold, then the fact that he has a complete iska with the investment part as well is considered his wages.<ref>Taz 177:9</ref> Most others disagree.<ref>Chelkat Binyamin 177:28 based on Chavot Daat, Shaarei Deah, and Sherit Chaim</ref> | |||
# If one stipulates that the agent only needs to give a certain amount of profits to the investor and all other profits are waived and given to the agent this can be considered wages for the agent.<ref>Shach 177:9, Chelka Binyamin (Kuntres Heter Iska n. 8) based on Rambam Sheluchin Vshutfin 6:4. See also Shulchan Aruch Y.D. 177:3.</ref> However, it must be stipulated that these are wages for his work and not simply that the investor waives his rights to them.<ref>Chelkat Binyamin 177:54 citing Chavot Daat</ref> | |||
# Poel batel's wage is defined as asking that the person would take as a salary not to have to work at all. This price would vary depending on their job.<ref>Chelkat Binyamin 177:31 and Milvah Hashem 2:12:4 follow the opinion of Tosfot either because Shulchan Aruch didn't clarify and we can be lenient since it is only rabbinic or because it is the simplest explanation in the words of Shulchan Aruch and the Bet Yosef elaborated upon that opinion. Chavot Daat 177:3 also holds that opinion.</ref> | # Poel batel's wage is defined as asking that the person would take as a salary not to have to work at all. This price would vary depending on their job.<ref>Chelkat Binyamin 177:31 and Milvah Hashem 2:12:4 follow the opinion of Tosfot either because Shulchan Aruch didn't clarify and we can be lenient since it is only rabbinic or because it is the simplest explanation in the words of Shulchan Aruch and the Bet Yosef elaborated upon that opinion. Chavot Daat 177:3 also holds that opinion.</ref> | ||
===Terms of the Iska=== | ===Terms of the Iska=== | ||
# The agent investing the money on behalf of the investor is considered a paid watchman ([[shomer]]) since he is being paid for his work.<ref>Shulchan Aruch Y.D. 177:5</ref> | # The agent investing the money on behalf of the investor is considered a paid watchman ([[shomer]]) since he is being paid for his work.<ref>Shulchan Aruch Y.D. 177:5</ref> | ||
