Pat Haba Bikisnin: Difference between revisions

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# If the pancakes were made with very little oil (just enough to prevent it from getting burned) then it is considered Pas Haba Bikisnin. If the pancakes were made with a significant amount of oil, there's a doubt whether it's considered Pas Haba Bekisnin or not and so if one intends to eat a [[Shiur Keviut Suedah]] one should eat it in a meal. If the pancakes were deep fried then the bracha is Mezonot even if a Shuir Keviut Suedah is consumed. <ref> Veten Bracha (Halachos of Brochos by Rabbi Bodner pg 493-4, chapter 27) </ref>
# If the pancakes were made with very little oil (just enough to prevent it from getting burned) then it is considered Pas Haba Bikisnin. If the pancakes were made with a significant amount of oil, there's a doubt whether it's considered Pas Haba Bekisnin or not and so if one intends to eat a [[Shiur Keviut Suedah]] one should eat it in a meal. If the pancakes were deep fried then the bracha is Mezonot even if a Shuir Keviut Suedah is consumed. <ref> Veten Bracha (Halachos of Brochos by Rabbi Bodner pg 493-4, chapter 27) </ref>


===Melba Toast==
===Melba Toast===
# Melba toast is a type of cracker made from toasted bread. Many say that the correct Bracha is Mezonot, while some say that the Bracha is HaMotzei. <ref>
# Melba toast is a type of cracker made from toasted bread. Many say that the correct Bracha is Mezonot, while some say that the Bracha is HaMotzei. <ref>
* S"A 168:7 rules that when one eats Pas HaBa BeKisnin as a snack the Bracha Rishona is Mezonot and Bracha Achrona is Al HaMichya, however, if one makes a meal out of it the bracha is HaMotzei and Birkat HaMazon. S"A 168:8 gives three definitions of Pas Haba BeKisnin and the last one is a hard dry baked goods.  
* S"A 168:7 rules that when one eats Pas HaBa BeKisnin as a snack the Bracha Rishona is Mezonot and Bracha Achrona is Al HaMichya, however, if one makes a meal out of it the bracha is HaMotzei and Birkat HaMazon. S"A 168:8 gives three definitions of Pas Haba BeKisnin and the last one is a hard dry baked goods.  

Revision as of 22:09, 17 August 2011

The Bracha of Pas Haba Bekisnin

  1. Someone who eats a Shuir Keviut Seuda of Pas HaBah Bekisnin must wash with a Bracha, make HaMotzei, and Birkat HaMazon. [1]
  2. However, if one eat a small amount of the Pas Haba Bekisnin as a snack one should make Mezonot, and Al HaMichya. [2]

Three definitions of Pas Haba Bikisnin

The S"A (168:7) rules that there are three definitions of Pas Haba Bikisnin. One therefore makes a Boreh Mineh Mezonot when eating an item that falls into one of the three categories:

  1. The dough itself is sweetened with fruit juice, oil, sugar, honey, margarine, etc.
  2. The bread is filled with a sweet filler such as: chocolate, nuts, fruit, etc. (i.e. Bourekas)
  3. The bread is very hard (and cracks when bent)

Explanation of the first definition

  1. According to Ashkenzim, if there’s a majority (51%) of sweeteners such as fruit juice, oil, egg, margarine, sugar, honey, or the like in comparison to the amount of water added to the flour, then the Bracha is mezonot. [3]However, water mixed into the sweeteners such as diluted fruited juice or margarine (usually 15% water) isn’t included in the calculations of sweeteners to water. [4]
  2. According to Sephardim, if the taste of the sweeteners is recognizable in the dough, then the Bracha is mezonot. [5]

Explanation of the second definition

  1. Dough which is filled with sweeteners such as nuts, chocolate, or the like and is cooked together with the dough, and the taste is recognizable, the bracha is Mezonot. [6]

Explanation of the third definition

  1. If the dough is cooked into a food that's hard and crumbles the bracha is Mezonot. [7]

Examples

  1. The following foods are called Pas HaBah BeKisnin and if one eats a Shuir Seuda one must make a HaMotzei: Berakas, Hotdog in pastry, cake, cookies, pretzels, crackers, and cereals made from the 5 grains. [8]
  2. The following foods are called Tavshil Mezonot and even if one eats a Shuir Seuda one makes a Mezonot: Farina, oatmeal, noodles, rice, soup nuts, farfel, couscous, blintzes, kugel*, and wafers*. [9]
  3. Egg Matzah which was kneaded with mostly fruit juice or eggs (as opposed to water) is considered Pas Haba BiKisnin. [10]
  4. If the pancakes were made with very little oil (just enough to prevent it from getting burned) then it is considered Pas Haba Bikisnin. If the pancakes were made with a significant amount of oil, there's a doubt whether it's considered Pas Haba Bekisnin or not and so if one intends to eat a Shiur Keviut Suedah one should eat it in a meal. If the pancakes were deep fried then the bracha is Mezonot even if a Shuir Keviut Suedah is consumed. [11]

Melba Toast

  1. Melba toast is a type of cracker made from toasted bread. Many say that the correct Bracha is Mezonot, while some say that the Bracha is HaMotzei. [12]

If the food is meant to fill

  1. Mezonot that fall into the category of filled dough or crumbling hard dough, if that food is meant to be eaten to fill oneself, one should make a HaMotzei regardless of how much one ate. However, foods that fall into the category of sweet dough, even if it’s meant to be eaten to satisfy hunger, one should make a Mezonot. [13]

Mezonot Rolls

  1. Since 'Mezonot' rolls are primarily eaten as part of a meal, many say that the bracha is HaMotzei (even if one eats a little) [14] and some say the bracha is Mezonot [15]. Therefore, one should eat it as part of a meal and make HaMotzei. [16] However, if that’s impossible, one has what to rely on to make a HaMotzei, and one has what to rely on to make a Mezonot. [17]

Pizza

  1. Regular Pizza (with dough that’s just flour and water or only an amount of fruit juice or oil that’s not recognizable in taste), according to Sephardim has the Bracha of HaMotzei even for a small amount. [18] However, according to Ashkenazim, in Israel the poskim hold that the bracha is Hamotzei, [19] and in America, some say that it depends on one's intent, if one intends to have it as a meal, then the bracha is HaMotzei and if one intends to have it as a snack the bracha is Mezonot. [20] whereas others maintain that the bracha is HaMotzei. However all agree if one eats a Shuir Seuda then one should make HaMotzei. [21]
  2. Pizza which was kneaded with a majority of fruit juice or eggs is a dispute, some say it's Mezonot, some say it's HaMotzei, and so one should eat it in a meal, and everyone agrees that if one eats the Shuir Seuda (which some say is 2 slices) one should make HaMotzei. [22]

Matzah

  1. The Ashkenazic minhag is to make HaMotzei on Matzeh all year round, whereas the Sephardic minhag is to make Mezonot except on Pesach. [23]

References

  1. ↑ S"A 168:6
  2. ↑ S"A 168:6
  3. ↑ Rama 168:7, Mishna Brurah 168:33 writes that such is the minhag of Ashkenazim.
  4. ↑ VeZot HaBracha (pg 17) in name of Rabbi Shlomo Zalman Auerbach and Sh”t Shevet HaLevi 9:44
  5. ↑ S”A 168:7, Yalkut Yosef (Brachot pg 129, Kitzur S”A 168:7)
  6. ↑ S"A 168:7, Mishna Brurah 168:33, Vezot HaBracha (pg 19, chapter 3)
  7. ↑ S"A 168:7. Vezot HaBracha (pg 19, chapter 3) points out that the Mishna Brurah (168:35) writes that it must be that it's usual to be eaten as a snack.
  8. ↑ Vezot HaBracha (pg 26, chapter 3)
  9. ↑ Vezot HaBracha (Chapter 4, pg 26). There he mentions that majority of poskim hold that kugel is Tavshil Mezonot and similarly concerning wafers there’s some doubt in the poskim even though the primary halacha is that it’s Tavshil Mezonot.
  10. ↑ Veten Bracha (Halachos of Brochos by Rabbi Bodner pg 501, chapter 27)
  11. ↑ Veten Bracha (Halachos of Brochos by Rabbi Bodner pg 493-4, chapter 27)
  12. ↑
    • S"A 168:7 rules that when one eats Pas HaBa BeKisnin as a snack the Bracha Rishona is Mezonot and Bracha Achrona is Al HaMichya, however, if one makes a meal out of it the bracha is HaMotzei and Birkat HaMazon. S"A 168:8 gives three definitions of Pas Haba BeKisnin and the last one is a hard dry baked goods.
    • [There is a dispute about how to explain why dry bread should be Mezonot. Some say that the reason is that since it is made as a snack and not as a meal food the bracha is Mezonot (Bet David quoted by Sedei Chemed "Brachot" 1:10). Others say that because it is very hard it's unlike regular bread and so the bracha is Mezonot (Aruch HaShulchan 168:21).
    • Vezot HaBracha (Birur Halacha 39, pg 306-8) explains that there are two applications to this dispute. (1) According to the first explanation it’s not essential that the bread be very hard, however, according to the other explanation the bread must be very dry and hard. (2) According to the first explanation if one intended to make bread in order to make toast as a snack the Bracha should be Mezonot, however, according to the other explanation once it was baked it is considered bread and it shouldn’t loose the status of bread because it’s toasted. Nonetheless, the Vezot HaBracha writes that it’s very possible that even the second explanation could agree because one’s whole intent was to make it into toast and it’s not very different than just having left the dough in the oven longer instead of removing it when it became bread. ]
    • Melba toast is a type of cracker made from regular bread which is toasted. Some say that since it was made a regular bread it is HaMotzei and toasting bread isn’t one of the ways which changes the status of bread (See 168:10). This is the opinion of the Laws of Brachos (Rabbi Forst, chap 8, pg 239) and the Star K.
    • However, others argue that since it was made from the beginning with the intent to make it into a snack type food which is hard and dry like a cracker the Bracha is Mezonot even though it started out as real bread. This is the opinion of Halachos of Brachos (Rabbi Bodner, chap 26, pg 467) and Vezot HaBracha (chap 3, pg 21 and Birur Halacha 39).
  13. ↑ S”A 168:17 rules that bread filled with meat or fish has the Bracha of HaMotzei. Magan Avraham 168:44 explains that this Bracha is made even if one doesn’t have a keviyut sueda because regarding sweets that fill the bread such as fruit there’s room to say that such fillers make the bread into a temporary snack, however, a substantial filler such as meat, fish, or cheese don’t make the bread change from HaMotzei to Mezonot. So rules the Mishna Brurah 168:94 and Yalkut Yosef (Brachot pg 125, Kitzur S”A 168:3). However, the Taz 168:20 argues that for filled bread the Bracha is Mezonot like in S”A 168:7 unless there’s a keviyut sueda. [Interestingly, the Ben Ish Chai (Pinchas 20), Kaf HaChaim 168:137, and Halacha Brurah 168:49 are concerned for the opinion of the Taz and hold that one should make sure to have more than a keviyut sueda, however if one doesn’t have enough and one doesn’t have bread, one should make a mezonot.] The VeZot HaBracha (pg 17 note 1) rules like Mishna Brurah that for bread that’s filled and is meant to fill one up the bracha is HaMotzei.
  14. ↑ Vezot HaBracha (pg 19, chapter 19 and pg 386) in name of Rav Elyashiv, Rav Nassim Karlitz, and Or Letzion (Vol 2, 12:4). Many American rabbis ruled that the bracha is HaMotzei including Rabbi Avraham Bik, Rabbi Reuven Feinstein, Rabbi Moshe Heinemann, Rav Moshe Shtern, Rabbi Yisrael Belsky, Rabbi Avrham Bloomenkrantz, and Veten Bracha (Halachos of Brochos by Rabbi Bodner pg 498-9, chapter 27) in name of Rabbi Shlomo Zalman regarding America.
  15. ↑ Vezot HaBracha (pg 18, chapter 3) in name of Rav Shlomo Zalman and the rabbis on the Badatz Edah Charedit
  16. ↑ http://www.oukosher.org/index.php/common/article/the_mezonos_roll_is_it_a_piece_of_cake_by_rabbi_yaakov_luban/ is the OU's position based on a Teshuva of Rabbi Yisrael Belsky which is that if a Mezonot roll is eaten as part of the meal the bracha is HaMotzei, see Making a meal on Mezonot. So holds the Star-K http://www.star-k.org/kashrus/kk-issues-pashabah.htm.
  17. ↑ Vezot HaBracha (Birur 56, pg 352)
  18. ↑ S”A 168:17 rules that bread filled with meat or fish has the Bracha of HaMotzei. Magan Avraham 168:44 explains that this Bracha is made even if one doesn't have a keviyut sueda because regarding sweets that fill the bread such as fruit there’s room to say that such fillers make the bread into a temporary snack, however, a substantial filler such as meat, fish, or cheese don’t make the bread change from HaMotzei to Mezonot. Therefore, Rabbi Ovadyah Yosef in Yalkut Yosef (Brachot pg 125, Kitzur S”A 168:3), Halichot Olam vol 2 pg 114, and Sh”t Yabea Omer 9:108(84) rules that regarding pizza the halacha is the same as dough filled with meat which has the Bracha of HaMotzei. So rules Chacham Ben Tzion Abba Shaul in Or Letzion (vol 2, 12:5), and Rabbi Moshe HaLevi in Birkat Hashem (vol 2, 2:62). However, the Taz 168:20 argues on the Magan Avraham and holds that for filled bread the Bracha is Mezonot just like if it was filled with sweets unless there’s a keviyut sueda. Halacha Brurah 168:49-50 is concerned for the opinion of the Taz and argues that seemingly pizza should be mezonot, however, he concludes that since it is always eaten as a meal food it is Hamotzei, but it's preferable to make sure to have more than a keviyut sueda and make HaMotzei.
  19. ↑ VeZot HaBracha (pg 21) quotes Rabbi Shlomo Zalman, Rabbi Sheinburg, and Rabbi Moshe Shternbach that the Bracha on pizza (which is made from water and flour) is HaMotzei.
  20. ↑ Veten Bracha (Halachos of Brochos by Rabbi Bodner pg 499-500, chapter 27) writes in the name of Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach that regarding America where some people eat it as a snack, it depends on each person's intent. http://www.yutorah.org/lectures/lecture.cfm/745055/Rabbi_Aryeh_Lebowitz/Ten_Minute_Halacha_-_Pas_Haba_B'kisnin seems to agree. The Star K writes that one slice is certainly a snack, three is certainly a meal, and two is questionable but if one eats it with a side dish then it would be considered a keviut seudah and one should make HaMotzei.
  21. ↑ Rav Mordechai Willig (Am Mordechai page 99) and Rav Yisroel Belsky (Mesora 1:40) hold that even in America the bracha is HaMotzei. This is also the opinion of the OU. See a summary of the subject at http://www.koltorah.org/ravj/14-38_The_Bracha_on_One_Slice_of_Pizza.htm [This also seems to be the opinion of Rav Dovid Feinstein see http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/brachos-on-pizza.] Pitchei Halacha (Laws of Brachos by Rabbi Binyamin Forst pg 235) finds a very hard time justifying making a Mezonot on one slice but says that if one has pizza as a meal one should certainly make HaMotzei.
  22. ↑ Vezot HaBracha (pg 22) writes in name of Rav Elyashiv and others that the status of such pizza is in doubt and so one should eat it in a meal or eat a Shuir Sueda which the Vezot HaBracha writes is 2 slices if one is full from that amount.
  23. ↑ Vezot HaBracha (pg 20)
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