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Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem: Difference between revisions

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==When we say it==
==When we say it==
# From the [[Mussaf]] of the last day of [[Sukkot]] until the [[Mussaf]] of the first day of [[Pesach]] (the winter months) we add in the phrase Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem. <Ref>Shulchan Aruch 114:1, Kitzur Shulchan Aruch 19:1 </ref>
# From the [[Mussaf]] of the last day of [[Sukkot]] until the [[Mussaf]] of the first day of [[Pesach]] (the winter months) we add in the phrase Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem. <Ref>Shulchan Aruch 114:1, Kitzur Shulchan Aruch 19:1 </ref>
# one may not begin reciting “Mashiv Haruach” in the Amida prayer until the Hazan announces before Musaf on Shemini Aseret that it should be recited. <ref> Shulchan Aruch 114:2 </ref>
# One may not begin reciting “Mashiv Haruach” in the Amida prayer until the Hazan announces before Musaf on Shemini Aseret that it should be recited. <ref> Shulchan Aruch 114:2 </ref>
==When to Stop Morid Hageshem and Start Tal==
# From Mussaf of the first day of Pesach, we begin to recite Morid Hatal. Sephardim start reciting Mashiv Haruach Umorid Hageshem with Mussaf<ref>Yalkut Yosef (Pesach n. 16), Chazon Ovadia Pesach 5763 p. 246</ref> and Ashkenazim have only the Shaliach Tzibur in the Chazarat Hashatz of Mussaf to stop saying Mashiv Haruach and say the Tikkun Hatal and then beginning with Mincha everyone should stop saying Mashiv Haruach Umorid Hageshem.<ref>Rama O.C. 114:3, Levush 114:2</ref>
 
==If one made a mistake in the winter==
==If one made a mistake in the winter==
# In the winter, if one said Morid HaTal instead of Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem if one remembered before the end of the Bracha one should say Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem before VeNeeman Atta LeHaChayot Meytim. <Ref>Kaf HaChaim 114:38 and Halacha Brurah 114:11 </ref> However, if one finished the Bracha one doesn’t go back to correct it<Ref>Shulchan Aruch OC 114:5.  
# In the winter, if one said Morid HaTal instead of Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem if one remembered before the end of the Bracha one should say Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem before VeNeeman Atta LeHaChayot Meytim. <Ref>Kaf HaChaim 114:38 and Halacha Brurah 114:11 </ref> However, if one finished the Bracha one doesn’t go back to correct it<Ref>Shulchan Aruch OC 114:5.  
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* However, the Taz 117:3 says that only a mentioning of dew satisfies the obligation because it too is a praise about how Hashem gives life through water (in rain and dew) to the world. The Pri Megadim (M”Z 114:11) says that according to the Taz if one only say Mashiv HaRuach and not Morid HaGeshem one would not have fulfilled one’s obligation, however, according to the Bet Yosef, one may have fulfilled one’s obligation. This is also quoted in the Kaf HaChaim 114:37. Mishna Brurah 114:26 holds in this case that should repeat Shemona Esrei.  
* However, the Taz 117:3 says that only a mentioning of dew satisfies the obligation because it too is a praise about how Hashem gives life through water (in rain and dew) to the world. The Pri Megadim (M”Z 114:11) says that according to the Taz if one only say Mashiv HaRuach and not Morid HaGeshem one would not have fulfilled one’s obligation, however, according to the Bet Yosef, one may have fulfilled one’s obligation. This is also quoted in the Kaf HaChaim 114:37. Mishna Brurah 114:26 holds in this case that should repeat Shemona Esrei.  
* The Tur 114:5, and Shulchan Aruch 114:5 codify the halacha like the Rif. </ref> even if one didn't yet start the next bracha.<ref>Ben Ish Chai (Beshalach no. 16) says one should insert Mashiv Haruach UMorid Hageshem before Atta Kadosh if one said Morid Hatal and remembered before starting the next bracha. Rav Ovadia Yosef in Yabia Omer 1:22:13 argues because the Bet Yosef 114:6 concludes that we would only use the idea of the Ravyah to insert a missed insertion immediately after the bracha before the next bracha for necessary insertions. However, in this situation once a person said Morid Hatal it is sufficient and so one shouldn't insert it before the next bracha. Halacha Brurah 114:11 agrees.</ref>
* The Tur 114:5, and Shulchan Aruch 114:5 codify the halacha like the Rif. </ref> even if one didn't yet start the next bracha.<ref>Ben Ish Chai (Beshalach no. 16) says one should insert Mashiv Haruach UMorid Hageshem before Atta Kadosh if one said Morid Hatal and remembered before starting the next bracha. Rav Ovadia Yosef in Yabia Omer 1:22:13 argues because the Bet Yosef 114:6 concludes that we would only use the idea of the Ravyah to insert a missed insertion immediately after the bracha before the next bracha for necessary insertions. However, in this situation once a person said Morid Hatal it is sufficient and so one shouldn't insert it before the next bracha. Halacha Brurah 114:11 agrees.</ref>
# Similarly, during the winter if one said both Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem and Morid HaTal one doesn’t go back to correct it. <ref>Shulchan Aruch 114:5 </ref>
# In the winter, if one forgot to say Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem and  
# In the winter, if one forgot to say Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem and  
## remembered before the end of the Bracha, one should say it where one remembered and continue from there <ref>  
## remembered before the end of the Bracha, one should say it where one remembered and continue from there <ref>  
* The Ravyah (quoted in the Mordechai (Tanit Siman 612, the first piece of Tanit) explains that if one forgot Mashiv HaRuach in the winter and remembered before the end of the bracha it’s sufficient to say Mashiv HaRuach and not return to the beginning of the Bracha because it’s recognizable that one is saying the correct insertion (see Ravyah above). However, the Rosh (Tanit 1:1) writes that if one remembers one should say it wherever one remembers.  
* The Ravyah (quoted in the Mordechai (Tanit Siman 612, the first piece of Tanit) explains that if one forgot Mashiv HaRuach in the winter and remembered before the end of the bracha it’s sufficient to say Mashiv HaRuach and not return to the beginning of the Bracha because it’s recognizable that one is saying the correct insertion (see Ravyah above). However, the Rosh (Tanit 1:1) writes that if one remembers one should say it wherever one remembers.  
* [This is according to the Bet Yosef 114:6 who says that there’s a dispute between the Rosh and Ravyah of how to understand the Gemara which says if one forgets to say Morid HaGeshem one has to repeat. The Ravyah understands the gemara to mean if one remembers before the end of the Bracha one should return to Mashiv HaRuach and continue with Mechalkel Chaim. However, the Rosh understands the Gemara to mean that if one finished the Bracha one must repeat [[Shmoneh Esrei]], however, if one didn’t finish the Bracha then the Rosh says based on logic that one may say it at any point. On the other hand, the Bach 114:7 says that both the Ravyah and Rosh agree that one may say it at any point in the Bracha. ]  
* [This is according to the Bet Yosef 114:6 who says that there’s a dispute between the Rosh and Ravyah of how to understand the Gemara which says if one forgets to say Morid HaGeshem one has to repeat. The Ravyah understands the gemara to mean if one remembers before the end of the Bracha one should return to Mashiv HaRuach and continue with Mechalkel Chaim. However, the Rosh understands the Gemara to mean that if one finished the Bracha one must repeat [[Shmoneh Esrei]], however, if one didn’t finish the Bracha then the Rosh says based on logic that one may say it at any point. On the other hand, the Bach 114:7 says that both the Ravyah and Rosh agree that one may say it at any point in the Bracha. ]  
* The S”A 114:6 rules like the Rosh that one should continue from the point one remembered. Halacha Brurah 114:12 rules like S”A. </ref> unless one already said VeNeeman Atta LeHachayot Meytim in which case one should return to that point say Mashiv HaRuach and continue. <Ref>Mishna Brurah 114:29 rules this way so that one is able to conclude the Bracha with the mean idea of the Bracha. This is also brought by the Kaf HaChaim 114:42 and Halacha Brurah 114:12. </ref>  
* The S”A 114:6 rules like the Rosh that one should continue from the point one remembered. Halacha Brurah 114:12 rules like S”A.</ref> unless one already said VeNeeman Atta LeHachayot Meytim in which case one should return to that point say Mashiv HaRuach and continue. <Ref>Mishna Brurah 114:29 rules this way so that one is able to conclude the Bracha with the mean idea of the Bracha. This is also brought by the Kaf HaChaim 114:42 and Halacha Brurah 114:12. </ref>  
## remembered after having said Baruch Atta Hashem before saying Mechaye Maytim, one should say Lamdeni Chukecha (למדני חוקיך) and then go back to Mashiv HaRuach and continue from there. <ref>
## remembered after having said Baruch Atta Hashem before saying Mechaye Maytim, one should say Lamdeni Chukecha (למדני חוקיך) and then go back to Mashiv HaRuach and continue from there. <ref>
* Beiur Halacha 114:6 s.v. BeLo Chatima quotes several reasons not to hold like the Ravyah (who says that one may insert Mashiv HaRuach after Mechaye Maytim before Atta Kadosh), however, he concludes that it’s difficult to rule against the Shulchan Aruch (who rules like the Ravyah) and many achronim who agree with S”A. The Beiur Halacha adds that if one remembers before finishing the Bracha one should conclude with the words Lamdeni Chukecha which is the conclusion of a פסוק and then one will be able to go back to Mashiv HaRuach and continue from there avoiding the situation of the Ravyah. Additionally, if one forgot VeTen Tal UMatar Lebracha one should say it in Shomeh [[Tefillah]] rather than say it before the next Bracha. The Mishna Brurah 114:32 seems to hold like Shulchan Aruch unless it’s possible to avoid this situation.  
* Beiur Halacha 114:6 s.v. BeLo Chatima quotes several reasons not to hold like the Ravyah (who says that one may insert Mashiv HaRuach after Mechaye Maytim before Atta Kadosh), however, he concludes that it’s difficult to rule against the Shulchan Aruch (who rules like the Ravyah) and many achronim who agree with S”A. The Beiur Halacha adds that if one remembers before finishing the Bracha one should conclude with the words Lamdeni Chukecha which is the conclusion of a פסוק and then one will be able to go back to Mashiv HaRuach and continue from there avoiding the situation of the Ravyah. Additionally, if one forgot VeTen Tal UMatar Lebracha one should say it in Shomeh [[Tefillah]] rather than say it before the next Bracha. The Mishna Brurah 114:32 seems to hold like Shulchan Aruch unless it’s possible to avoid this situation.  
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==Sources==
==Sources==
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