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Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem: Difference between revisions

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* The S”A 114:6 rules like the Rosh that one should continue from the point one remembered. Halacha Brurah 114:12 rules like S”A. </ref> unless one already said VeNeeman Atta LeHachayot Meytim in which case one should return to that point say Mashiv HaRuach and continue. <Ref>Mishna Brurah 114:29 rules this way so that one is able to conclude the Bracha with the mean idea of the Bracha. This is also brought by the Kaf HaChaim 114:42 and Halacha Brurah 114:12. </ref>  
* The S”A 114:6 rules like the Rosh that one should continue from the point one remembered. Halacha Brurah 114:12 rules like S”A. </ref> unless one already said VeNeeman Atta LeHachayot Meytim in which case one should return to that point say Mashiv HaRuach and continue. <Ref>Mishna Brurah 114:29 rules this way so that one is able to conclude the Bracha with the mean idea of the Bracha. This is also brought by the Kaf HaChaim 114:42 and Halacha Brurah 114:12. </ref>  
## remembered after having said Baruch Atta Hashem before saying Mechaye Maytim, one should say Lamdeni Chukecha (למדני חוקיך) and then go back to Mashiv HaRuach and continue from there. <ref>
## remembered after having said Baruch Atta Hashem before saying Mechaye Maytim, one should say Lamdeni Chukecha (למדני חוקיך) and then go back to Mashiv HaRuach and continue from there. <ref>
* Biur Halacha 114:6 D”H BeLo Chatima quotes several reasons not to hold like the Ravyah (who says that one may insert Mashiv HaRuach after Mechaye Maytim before Atta Kadosh), however, he concludes that it’s difficult to rule against the Shulchan Aruch (who rules like the Ravyah) and many achronim who agree with S”A. The Biur Halacha adds that if one remembers before finishing the Bracha one should conclude with the words Lamdeni Chukecha which is the conclusion of a פסוק and then one will be able to go back to Mashiv HaRuach and continue from there avoiding the situation of the Ravyah. Additionally, if one forgot VeTen Tal UMatar Lebracha one should say it in Shomeh Tefillah rather than say it before the next Bracha. The Mishna Brurah 114:32 seems to hold like Shulchan Aruch unless it’s possible to avoid this situation.  
* Biur Halacha 114:6 s.v. BeLo Chatima quotes several reasons not to hold like the Ravyah (who says that one may insert Mashiv HaRuach after Mechaye Maytim before Atta Kadosh), however, he concludes that it’s difficult to rule against the Shulchan Aruch (who rules like the Ravyah) and many achronim who agree with S”A. The Biur Halacha adds that if one remembers before finishing the Bracha one should conclude with the words Lamdeni Chukecha which is the conclusion of a פסוק and then one will be able to go back to Mashiv HaRuach and continue from there avoiding the situation of the Ravyah. Additionally, if one forgot VeTen Tal UMatar Lebracha one should say it in Shomeh Tefillah rather than say it before the next Bracha. The Mishna Brurah 114:32 seems to hold like Shulchan Aruch unless it’s possible to avoid this situation.  
* However, the Sh”t Igrot Moshe 4:93 argues on the Biur Halacha and says that the advise of concluding the Bracha with Lamdeni Chukecha isn’t a viable option because it’s considered an interruption to speak words of Torah in middle of [[Shemoneh Esrei]]. Rather the Igrot Moshe says that one should rely on Shulchan Aruch completely and if one remembers after having said Baruch Atta Hashem one should finish the Bracha and then say Mashiv HaRuach right there before the next Bracha.  
* However, the Sh”t Igrot Moshe 4:93 argues on the Biur Halacha and says that the advise of concluding the Bracha with Lamdeni Chukecha isn’t a viable option because it’s considered an interruption to speak words of Torah in middle of [[Shemoneh Esrei]]. Rather the Igrot Moshe says that one should rely on Shulchan Aruch completely and if one remembers after having said Baruch Atta Hashem one should finish the Bracha and then say Mashiv HaRuach right there before the next Bracha.  
* Despite the argument of the Igrot Moshe, most achronim side with the Biur Halacha including Ben Ish Chai (Nitsavim #20), Kaf HaChaim 114:28, Sh”t Bear Moshe 4:18, Or Letzion (vol 2, 7:29), Sh”t Yabia Omer 1:22, Sh”t Yechave Daat 5:49, Tefillah KeHilchata 12:28, and Piskei Teshuvot 114:9. </ref>
* Despite the argument of the Igrot Moshe, most achronim side with the Biur Halacha including Ben Ish Chai (Nitsavim #20), Kaf HaChaim 114:28, Sh”t Bear Moshe 4:18, Or Letzion (vol 2, 7:29), Sh”t Yabia Omer 1:22, Sh”t Yechave Daat 5:49, Tefillah KeHilchata 12:28, and Piskei Teshuvot 114:9. </ref>
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## remembered after having completed the Bracha and started the next Bracha, one has to repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]]. <ref> Rabbi Chanina in Gemara Tanit (3b) says that if one forgot to say Morid HaGeshem in the winter months one must repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]]. This is the ruling of the Rif (Tanit 1a), Rosh (Tanit 1:1), Rambam (Tefillah 10:8), Tur 114:5, and S”A 114:5. </ref>
## remembered after having completed the Bracha and started the next Bracha, one has to repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]]. <ref> Rabbi Chanina in Gemara Tanit (3b) says that if one forgot to say Morid HaGeshem in the winter months one must repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]]. This is the ruling of the Rif (Tanit 1a), Rosh (Tanit 1:1), Rambam (Tefillah 10:8), Tur 114:5, and S”A 114:5. </ref>
# In the winter, if one said Morid HaTal instead of Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem if one remembered before the end of the Bracha one should say Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem before VeNeeman Atta LeHaChayot Meytim. <Ref>Kaf HaChaim 114:38 and Halacha Brurah 114:11 </ref> However, if one finished the Bracha one doesn’t go back to correct it. <Ref>S”A 114:5  
# In the winter, if one said Morid HaTal instead of Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem if one remembered before the end of the Bracha one should say Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem before VeNeeman Atta LeHaChayot Meytim. <Ref>Kaf HaChaim 114:38 and Halacha Brurah 114:11 </ref> However, if one finished the Bracha one doesn’t go back to correct it. <Ref>S”A 114:5  
* The Rif (Tanit 1a) quotes the Yerushalmi (Tanit 1:1) which says that even though if one forgets to say Morid HaGeshem if one said Morid HaTal in it’s place one has fulfilled one’s obligation. The Tosfot (Brachot 29b D”H Ha), Rabbenu Yonah (19b D”H VeOmrim), Rosh (Brachot 4:14), and Rambam (Tefillah 10:8) agree with the Rif against the Ran (Tanit 1b D”H Haya) who questions the Rif.  
* The Rif (Tanit 1a) quotes the Yerushalmi (Tanit 1:1) which says that even though if one forgets to say Morid HaGeshem if one said Morid HaTal in it’s place one has fulfilled one’s obligation. The Tosfot (Brachot 29b s.v. Ha), Rabbenu Yonah (19b s.v. VeOmrim), Rosh (Brachot 4:14), and Rambam (Tefillah 10:8) agree with the Rif against the Ran (Tanit 1b s.v. Haya) who questions the Rif.  
* The Rabbenu Yonah (19b D”H VeOmrim) explain that only in the second Bracha of Atta Gibor does a mention of dew satisfy the obligation of mentioning rain because the only obligation is to mention a praise of Hashem, however, in the Bracha for rain (Birkat HaShanim, the ninth bracha) a mention of dew doesn’t satisfy the obligation because there’s an obligation to request rain and requesting dew is a different (and unnecessary) request altogether.  
* The Rabbenu Yonah (19b s.v. VeOmrim) explain that only in the second Bracha of Atta Gibor does a mention of dew satisfy the obligation of mentioning rain because the only obligation is to mention a praise of Hashem, however, in the Bracha for rain (Birkat HaShanim, the ninth bracha) a mention of dew doesn’t satisfy the obligation because there’s an obligation to request rain and requesting dew is a different (and unnecessary) request altogether.  
* Similarly, the Bet Yosef 114:5 explains that the obligation to praise Hashem that He supplies the needs of the world is preferably fulfilled with the mention of rain because rain is an immediate need, however, after the fact it is fulfilled with the mentioning of dew because it too is a mentioning of a need of the world.  
* Similarly, the Bet Yosef 114:5 explains that the obligation to praise Hashem that He supplies the needs of the world is preferably fulfilled with the mention of rain because rain is an immediate need, however, after the fact it is fulfilled with the mentioning of dew because it too is a mentioning of a need of the world.  
* However, the Taz 117:3 says that only a mentioning of dew satisfies the obligation because it too is a praise about how Hashem gives life through water (in rain and dew) to the world. The Pri Megadim (M”Z 114:11) says that according to the Taz if one only say Mashiv HaRuach and not Morid HaGeshem one would not have fulfilled one’s obligation, however, according to the Bet Yosef, one may have fulfilled one’s obligation. This is also quoted in the Kaf HaChaim 114:37. ]  
* However, the Taz 117:3 says that only a mentioning of dew satisfies the obligation because it too is a praise about how Hashem gives life through water (in rain and dew) to the world. The Pri Megadim (M”Z 114:11) says that according to the Taz if one only say Mashiv HaRuach and not Morid HaGeshem one would not have fulfilled one’s obligation, however, according to the Bet Yosef, one may have fulfilled one’s obligation. This is also quoted in the Kaf HaChaim 114:37. ]  
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# In the summer one shouldn’t say Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem. If by mistake one did say it and one didn’t finish the Bracha one should return to the beginning of the Bracha (Atta Gibor) and continue from there. However, if one finished the Bracha, one must start [[Shemoneh Esrei]] again from the beginning. <Ref>S”A 114:4  
# In the summer one shouldn’t say Mashiv HaRuach UMorid HaGeshem. If by mistake one did say it and one didn’t finish the Bracha one should return to the beginning of the Bracha (Atta Gibor) and continue from there. However, if one finished the Bracha, one must start [[Shemoneh Esrei]] again from the beginning. <Ref>S”A 114:4  
* The Gemara Tanit (3b) quotes Rabbi Chanina who says that if one said Morid HaGeshem in the summer one has to repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]]. Rashi (3b D”h Morid HaGeshem Machzirin) explains that one must repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]] because it’s a curse for there to be rain in the summer.  
* The Gemara Tanit (3b) quotes Rabbi Chanina who says that if one said Morid HaGeshem in the summer one has to repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]]. Rashi (3b D”h Morid HaGeshem Machzirin) explains that one must repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]] because it’s a curse for there to be rain in the summer.  
* The Ran (Tanit 1b D”H Tu Garsinan, quoted by Bet Yosef 114:4) asks why someone has to repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]] in the last 15 days of Nissan if rain is only a curse after Nissan and he answers that since rain is a curse the majority of the summer months the rabbis didn’t make any distinction and obligated one to repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]] in both cases.  
* The Ran (Tanit 1b s.v. Tu Garsinan, quoted by Bet Yosef 114:4) asks why someone has to repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]] in the last 15 days of Nissan if rain is only a curse after Nissan and he answers that since rain is a curse the majority of the summer months the rabbis didn’t make any distinction and obligated one to repeat [[Shemoneh Esrei]] in both cases.  
* The Rosh (Tanit 1:1) writes that if during the summer one said (Mashiv HaRuach U)Morid HaGeshem and one remembers before the end of the Bracha one should return to the beginning of the Bracha. However, if one finished the Bracha one must return to the beginning of [[Shemoneh Esrei]] because the first three Brachot of [[Shemoneh Esrei]] are considered like one unit. This is also the opinion of the Ravyah (quoted in the Mordechai (Tanit Siman 612, the first piece of Tanit).  
* The Rosh (Tanit 1:1) writes that if during the summer one said (Mashiv HaRuach U)Morid HaGeshem and one remembers before the end of the Bracha one should return to the beginning of the Bracha. However, if one finished the Bracha one must return to the beginning of [[Shemoneh Esrei]] because the first three Brachot of [[Shemoneh Esrei]] are considered like one unit. This is also the opinion of the Ravyah (quoted in the Mordechai (Tanit Siman 612, the first piece of Tanit).  
* The Ravyah (quoted in the Mordechai (Tanit Siman 612, the first piece of Tanit) explains that if one said Mashiv HaRuach in the summer returning to Mechalkel Chaim isn’t sufficient because it’s not recognizable that one is making an omission (as one says that everyday) rather one should start from the beginning of the Bracha and then the omission of Mashiv HaRuach is evident.  
* The Ravyah (quoted in the Mordechai (Tanit Siman 612, the first piece of Tanit) explains that if one said Mashiv HaRuach in the summer returning to Mechalkel Chaim isn’t sufficient because it’s not recognizable that one is making an omission (as one says that everyday) rather one should start from the beginning of the Bracha and then the omission of Mashiv HaRuach is evident.  
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