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Ikar and Tafel: Difference between revisions
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* Vezot HaBracha (chap 11, pg 92) writes that if the cheese layer is baked together with the crust layer the Bracha is [[Mezonot]] based on Kol SheYesh Bo. | * Vezot HaBracha (chap 11, pg 92) writes that if the cheese layer is baked together with the crust layer the Bracha is [[Mezonot]] based on Kol SheYesh Bo. | ||
* Laws of [[Brachos]] (Rabbi Forst, chap 7, pg 219) writes in general the crust is used to add flavor and if so the Bracha is [[Mezonot]], however if the crust is only meant to hold the cheese the Bracha is [[Shehakol]]. The [http://www.ou.org/publications/brachot/default.htm OU] agrees. | * Laws of [[Brachos]] (Rabbi Forst, chap 7, pg 219) writes in general the crust is used to add flavor and if so the Bracha is [[Mezonot]], however if the crust is only meant to hold the cheese the Bracha is [[Shehakol]]. The [http://www.ou.org/publications/brachot/default.htm OU] agrees. | ||
** The second clause is based on the following: S”A 168:8 and 212:2 rules that if one eats jam/marmalade on a cracker one should only make a Bracha on the marmalade and it exempts the cracker. Mishna Brurah 168:45 explains that in the case of S”A one was only eating the jam on the cracker so as not to dirty one’s hands. Then, he quotes the | ** The second clause is based on the following: S”A 168:8 and 212:2 rules that if one eats jam/marmalade on a cracker one should only make a Bracha on the marmalade and it exempts the cracker. Mishna Brurah 168:45 explains that in the case of S”A one was only eating the jam on the cracker so as not to dirty one’s hands. Then, he quotes the Magen Avraham 212:5 who writes that nowadays the crackers have a good taste and one should make [[Mezonot]] and exempt the jam. Mishna Brurah concludes by saying that it’s only one Bracha when it is baked together, however, if they’re baked separately it would require two [[Brachot]]. | ||
* Laws of [[Brachos]] (chap 7, pg 219, note 48) writes his ruling that if the thin crust is added for it’s taste even if wouldn’t be eaten on it’s own, the Bracha should be [[mezonot]] is based on the Mishna Brurah 168:45 but feels that Rav Moshe in Igrot Moshe 4:43 would disagree and hold that if one wouldn’t want to eat the crust on its own the Bracha is only [[Shehakol]]. | * Laws of [[Brachos]] (chap 7, pg 219, note 48) writes his ruling that if the thin crust is added for it’s taste even if wouldn’t be eaten on it’s own, the Bracha should be [[mezonot]] is based on the Mishna Brurah 168:45 but feels that Rav Moshe in Igrot Moshe 4:43 would disagree and hold that if one wouldn’t want to eat the crust on its own the Bracha is only [[Shehakol]]. | ||
** Igrot Moshe 4:43 writes that for an ice cream sandwich one should make two [[Brachot]], [[mezonot]] on the wafer and [[Shehakol]] on the ice cream and if one only wants the ice cream but only eats the wafer simply because it’s there the Bracha is [[Shehakol]] and it exempts the wafer. However, Laws of [[Brachos]] (chap 7, pg 217, note 40) argues that even if the crust is negligible the Bracha should be [[mezonot]] as long as it adds a taste. | ** Igrot Moshe 4:43 writes that for an ice cream sandwich one should make two [[Brachot]], [[mezonot]] on the wafer and [[Shehakol]] on the ice cream and if one only wants the ice cream but only eats the wafer simply because it’s there the Bracha is [[Shehakol]] and it exempts the wafer. However, Laws of [[Brachos]] (chap 7, pg 217, note 40) argues that even if the crust is negligible the Bracha should be [[mezonot]] as long as it adds a taste. | ||
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# For knishes in the usual case where the dough is substantial, the Bracha is [[mezonot]]. <Ref> Veten Bracha (Halachos of Brochos by Rabbi Pinchas Bodner, chapter 4, pg 79) </ref> | # For knishes in the usual case where the dough is substantial, the Bracha is [[mezonot]]. <Ref> Veten Bracha (Halachos of Brochos by Rabbi Pinchas Bodner, chapter 4, pg 79) </ref> | ||
# For the bracha on Boston cream pies, if one has the filling as an enhancer of the cake then the bracha is [[Mezonot]], however, if the filling is considered a thick layer for which one has intent to eat (not merely as an enhancer), then make two [[brachot]], [[mezonot]] on the cake, and [[Shehakol]] on the filling. <ref> | # For the bracha on Boston cream pies, if one has the filling as an enhancer of the cake then the bracha is [[Mezonot]], however, if the filling is considered a thick layer for which one has intent to eat (not merely as an enhancer), then make two [[brachot]], [[mezonot]] on the cake, and [[Shehakol]] on the filling. <ref> | ||
* S”A 168:8 and 212:2 rules that if one eats jam/marmalade on a cracker one should only make a Bracha on the marmalade and it exempts the cracker. | * S”A 168:8 and 212:2 rules that if one eats jam/marmalade on a cracker one should only make a Bracha on the marmalade and it exempts the cracker. Magen Avraham 212:5 writes that one honey crackers are primary and one only makes a Bracha on that and it covers the marmalade. | ||
* Mishna Brurah 168:45 rules like the | * Mishna Brurah 168:45 rules like the Magen Avraham but adds that it’s only one Bracha when it is baked together, however, if they’re baked separately it would require two [[Brachot]], one for the cracker, one for the marmalade because one is not eaten as an enhancer of the other but rather one is eating it for both of the cracker and the jam. However, Mishna Brurah 212:6 rules that if one eats cheese on a cracker one only makes a Bracha on the cracker even if one likes the cheese because one is eating the cheese as a spread. | ||
**[It’s clear that the Mishna Brurah 212:6 is discussing where one didn’t bake it together, because if so, the Shaar HaTziyun 212:21 should have answered that the difference in cases between in 212:5 and 212:6 was that in 212:5 it wasn’t baked together and in 212:6 it was.] Similarly, Sh”t Shevet HaLevi 7:27(6) explains that Mishna Brurah 168:45 only meant to make two [[Brachot]] when there’s a thick layer of jam but if there’s a thin layer one should only make one Bracha. | **[It’s clear that the Mishna Brurah 212:6 is discussing where one didn’t bake it together, because if so, the Shaar HaTziyun 212:21 should have answered that the difference in cases between in 212:5 and 212:6 was that in 212:5 it wasn’t baked together and in 212:6 it was.] Similarly, Sh”t Shevet HaLevi 7:27(6) explains that Mishna Brurah 168:45 only meant to make two [[Brachot]] when there’s a thick layer of jam but if there’s a thin layer one should only make one Bracha. | ||
* To clarify this distinction: Vezot HaBracha (chap 11, pg 99) rules that if there’s a cake with a thick layer of whipped cream, cheese, or ice cream and the two were not baked together one should make two [[Brachot]] (similar to the case of Mishna Brurah 168:45). However, if one eats the cream or topping of fruit, chocolate, or nuts in order to enhance the cake one should only make a Bracha on the cake. [See Vezot HaBracha (Birur 42) where he explains the distinction at length.] | * To clarify this distinction: Vezot HaBracha (chap 11, pg 99) rules that if there’s a cake with a thick layer of whipped cream, cheese, or ice cream and the two were not baked together one should make two [[Brachot]] (similar to the case of Mishna Brurah 168:45). However, if one eats the cream or topping of fruit, chocolate, or nuts in order to enhance the cake one should only make a Bracha on the cake. [See Vezot HaBracha (Birur 42) where he explains the distinction at length.] | ||
