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Hatmana: Difference between revisions
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→Insulating before Shabbat
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# Conversely, it is permitted to insulate before [[Shabbat]] with material that doesn’t preserve heat like a cloth. <Ref> Shemirat [[Shabbat]] KeHilchata 1:75, implied from Shulchan Aruch 257:1,3. The Gemara ([[Shabbat]] 48a) says that clothing are a material that don’t preserve heat. </ref> However, there is a dispute if a pot that is covered with clothes can be placed on a heating element, which would cause the pot to get hot. See further. | # Conversely, it is permitted to insulate before [[Shabbat]] with material that doesn’t preserve heat like a cloth. <Ref> Shemirat [[Shabbat]] KeHilchata 1:75, implied from Shulchan Aruch 257:1,3. The Gemara ([[Shabbat]] 48a) says that clothing are a material that don’t preserve heat. </ref> However, there is a dispute if a pot that is covered with clothes can be placed on a heating element, which would cause the pot to get hot. See further. | ||
## Everyone agrees that before Shabbat it is permissible to wrap a pot that is off the fire or on top of a hot pot which is off the fire. <ref>Shulchan Aruch 258:1, Mishna Brurah 258:2, Shemirat [[Shabbat]] KeHilchata 1:75 </ref> | ## Everyone agrees that before Shabbat it is permissible to wrap a pot that is off the fire or on top of a hot pot which is off the fire. <ref>Shulchan Aruch 258:1, Mishna Brurah 258:2, Shemirat [[Shabbat]] KeHilchata 1:75 </ref> | ||
## According to most poskim, it is forbidden even before Shabbat to wrap a pot with clothes if the pot is on a covered fire or electric hotplate. <Ref>Shulchan Aruch 257:8 explains that even though covering with a cloth is considered something doesn't preserve the heat, since the pot is top of the fire insulating the pot with the cloth becomes like it is insulated with something that preserves the heat, which is forbidden even on Friday. Mishna Brurah 257:37, Kaf Hachaim 257:40, and Shemirat [[Shabbat]] KeHilchata 1:75 agree.</ref> However, | ## According to most poskim, it is forbidden even before Shabbat to wrap a pot with clothes if the pot is on a covered fire or electric hotplate. <Ref>Shulchan Aruch 257:8 explains that even though covering with a cloth is considered something doesn't preserve the heat, since the pot is top of the fire insulating the pot with the cloth becomes like it is insulated with something that preserves the heat, which is forbidden even on Friday. Mishna Brurah 257:37, Kaf Hachaim 257:40, and Shemirat [[Shabbat]] KeHilchata 1:75 agree.</ref> However, if a Sephardic Jew has such a minhag he doesn't need to be stopped.<ref> Chazon Ovadia (Shabbat v. 1 p. 56) writes that some are lenient and there is a minhag to be lenient against Shulchan Aruch. | ||
* When Hatmana on it’s own doesn’t preserve heat but keeps in heat because of another source (that besides the cover of clothing, the food is on a Garuf or Katum stove) there is a dispute in the Rishonim if there’s an issue of Hatmana with something that preserves heat. Ran ([[Shabbat]] Bameh Tomnin) in name of Rabbenu Yonah and Rashba writes that if the insulation preserves heat because of an external source it is forbidden as Hatmana Dvar Hamosif Hevel because this insulation shows one is concerned about keeping the food warm. However, the Ramban permits if the Hatmana is done with permitted material and the Shehiyah (leaving food on a covered stove from before [[Shabbat]]) is done in a permitted way because these are two separate Gezerahs (the Gemara 47b which seemingly prohibits putting an insulated pot on a permitted stove is only forbidden because the food is put directly on the coals but if there’s a space of air in between the coals and the food it’d be permitted.) Ran (22a s.v. VeMinhagenu), Nemukei Yosef ( | * When Hatmana on it’s own doesn’t preserve heat but keeps in heat because of another source (that besides the cover of clothing, the food is on a Garuf or Katum stove) there is a dispute in the Rishonim if there’s an issue of Hatmana with something that preserves heat. Ran ([[Shabbat]] Bameh Tomnin) in name of Rabbenu Yonah and Rashba writes that if the insulation preserves heat because of an external source it is forbidden as Hatmana Dvar Hamosif Hevel because this insulation shows one is concerned about keeping the food warm. However, the Ramban permits if the Hatmana is done with permitted material and the Shehiyah (leaving food on a covered stove from before [[Shabbat]]) is done in a permitted way because these are two separate Gezerahs (the Gemara 47b which seemingly prohibits putting an insulated pot on a permitted stove is only forbidden because the food is put directly on the coals but if there’s a space of air in between the coals and the food it’d be permitted.) Ran (22a s.v. VeMinhagenu), Nemukei Yosef (Lo Yachpor), Rabbenu Yerucham (pg 68c), and Meiri ([[Shabbat]] Perek Kirah pg 142 s.v. Zu Hiy) write that the Minhag is like the Ramban's explanation. Ritva 47b mentions the Ramban and adds that some are strict to make a separation between the clothing and the pot (as that’s not the usual way to insulate) but concludes that he prefers a different stringency which is putting the pot on top of a cover that separates between the pot and stove. S”A 257:8 rules even though Shehiyah is permitted in certain cases (see S”A 253) if the pot is covered with clothes even though it is a material that doesn’t preserve heat it’s forbidden to be left on the fire. | ||
* Sh”t Chut MeShulash 8, Shaarei Yeshua 5:8, and Sh”t Divrei Moshe 64 say that the Minhag has what to rely on even though S”A was strict. Sh”t Zechur LeYitzchak 74 pg 113b brings the opinion of Maharar Moshe Ben Chaviv who says the Minhag has what to rely on based on the Ramban and the opinions that there’s no issue of Hatmana if the food is [[cooking]] for [[Shabbat]] day; nonetheless, Zechur LeYitzchak suggests that since the Minhag predates S”A it can continue, but concludes that one should be strict like S”A. Eretz Chaim 257, Memei Shlomo 257, Sh”t Yaskil Avdi 3:10(4:7), Gedolei Tzion 9:11 also quote the Maharar Ben Chaviv and Chazon Ovadyah ([[Shabbat]] 1 pg 56; as in Sh”t Yabia Omer O”C 6:33) conclude that one can be lenient. Halacha Brurah 257:29 writes that one doesn't need to stop someone who is lenient since there is what to rely upon.</ref> | |||
## If the cloth is placed on top of a wide tray on top of a pot which is on the covered fire such that the cloth doesn't actually touch the sides of the pot it is permitted.<ref> The Tur 257:8 adds that his father the Rosh held that if the clothes aren’t touching the pot it is permitted and not a normal way to do hatmana. Thus, Shulchan Aruch 257:8 rules that if the pot isn’t touching the coals it is a permissible Shehiyah and if one puts a tray on pot of the pot and clothing on top of the tray so that the cloth doesn’t touch the sides of the pot it is a permissible hatmana. Minchat Cohen (Mishmeret [[Shabbat]] 8) explains that S”A requires both requirements: 1) the pot doesn’t touch the coals and 2) the clothes don’t touch the sides of the pot. Shemirat Shabbat Kehilchata 1:76 accepts this.</ref> | |||
## According to most poskim it is forbidden to insulate a pot before Shabbat if it is on top of another pot which is on the fire.<ref>Kaf Hachaim 258:3 writes based on the Magen Avraham 258:1 that insulating a pot on top of another pot that is on the fire is forbidden even before Shabbat since it is considered like hatmana bdvar hamosif hevel. Mishna Brurah 258:2 implies this as well. Kaf Hachaim adds that according to the lenient opinion in the Rama 257:7 since there is no issue of shehiya on a pot on top of another pot there's also no issue of hatmana, but that is only if that is the minhag.</ref> | ## According to most poskim it is forbidden to insulate a pot before Shabbat if it is on top of another pot which is on the fire.<ref>Kaf Hachaim 258:3 writes based on the Magen Avraham 258:1 that insulating a pot on top of another pot that is on the fire is forbidden even before Shabbat since it is considered like hatmana bdvar hamosif hevel. Mishna Brurah 258:2 implies this as well. Kaf Hachaim adds that according to the lenient opinion in the Rama 257:7 since there is no issue of shehiya on a pot on top of another pot there's also no issue of hatmana, but that is only if that is the minhag.</ref> | ||
===Food in Other Food=== | |||
# There is no issue of [[insulating food]] inside other food if there's no separation. <Ref> Shemirat [[Shabbat]] KeHilchata 1:72 </ref> | # There is no issue of [[insulating food]] inside other food if there's no separation. <Ref> Shemirat [[Shabbat]] KeHilchata 1:72 </ref> | ||
# Before [[Shabbat]], some say that one can leave fully cooked food in a plastic, nylon, or aluminum bag in an pot of hot food (such as kuggel in chulent), however, some forbid because of Hatmana. <Ref> Chazon Ish 37:32 rules that a vessel inside a pot of hot water doesn’t have an issue of Hatmana. Even though, Aruch HaShulchan 258:3 and Sh”t Shevet HaLevi 3:47 argue on the Chazon Ish, Chazon Ovadyah ([[Shabbat]] 1 pg 62) says one can rely on the Chazon Ish to be lenient, especially if the food is fully cooked (for which Rama 257:7 permits Hatmana). Sh”t Shevet HaLevi 8:15(4) says that there is what to be lenient since the bag is only separating the food inside it but it would have been hot from the pot nonetheless. Sh”t Vayeshev Moshe (Zanger) O”C 19 adds that the bag or aluminum isn’t a real vessel that separates the food inside it. Rav Shlomo Zalman in Sh”t Minchat Shlomo (2:34(20) in Ostrot Shlomo version), Sh”t LeHorot Natan O”C 12, Kovetz Or Yisrael 5:23, Sh”t Shraga HaMeir 4:63, 6:3, Megilat Sefer on [[Shabbat]] 4:13, Sh”t Kinyan Torah 4:24, Sh”t Az Nidabru 6:78, Sh”t Or Letzion 2:17(13), and Sh”t Maaseh Nisim 163 agree that there’s no Hatmana in our case of a food within another food since it’s not meant to be totally separate. [Even though Shemirat [[Shabbat]] 42:63 is strict regarding materials that don’t allow liquid through such as plastic, nylon, and aluminum, however in the new edition there’s a retraction in 1:87 quoting Rav Shlomo Zalman to permit in all circumstances.] Meor [[Shabbat]] 3 pg 519, and Menuchat Ahavah 1:3(27) are somewhat strict on the issue, the Minhag is to be lenient on this issue. </ref>. | # Before [[Shabbat]], some say that one can leave fully cooked food in a plastic, nylon, or aluminum bag in an pot of hot food (such as kuggel in chulent), however, some forbid because of Hatmana. <Ref> Chazon Ish 37:32 rules that a vessel inside a pot of hot water doesn’t have an issue of Hatmana. Even though, Aruch HaShulchan 258:3 and Sh”t Shevet HaLevi 3:47 argue on the Chazon Ish, Chazon Ovadyah ([[Shabbat]] 1 pg 62) says one can rely on the Chazon Ish to be lenient, especially if the food is fully cooked (for which Rama 257:7 permits Hatmana). Sh”t Shevet HaLevi 8:15(4) says that there is what to be lenient since the bag is only separating the food inside it but it would have been hot from the pot nonetheless. Sh”t Vayeshev Moshe (Zanger) O”C 19 adds that the bag or aluminum isn’t a real vessel that separates the food inside it. Rav Shlomo Zalman in Sh”t Minchat Shlomo (2:34(20) in Ostrot Shlomo version), Sh”t LeHorot Natan O”C 12, Kovetz Or Yisrael 5:23, Sh”t Shraga HaMeir 4:63, 6:3, Megilat Sefer on [[Shabbat]] 4:13, Sh”t Kinyan Torah 4:24, Sh”t Az Nidabru 6:78, Sh”t Or Letzion 2:17(13), and Sh”t Maaseh Nisim 163 agree that there’s no Hatmana in our case of a food within another food since it’s not meant to be totally separate. [Even though Shemirat [[Shabbat]] 42:63 is strict regarding materials that don’t allow liquid through such as plastic, nylon, and aluminum, however in the new edition there’s a retraction in 1:87 quoting Rav Shlomo Zalman to permit in all circumstances.] Meor [[Shabbat]] 3 pg 519, and Menuchat Ahavah 1:3(27) are somewhat strict on the issue, the Minhag is to be lenient on this issue. </ref>. | ||
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# One may not completely wrap a pot with a blanket or towel if the pot is on top of a hot plate, covered fire, or any other heating element. Even though the blanket or towel is considered something that doesn't add heat, it is nonetheless considered as something that adds heat once it is on top of a pot which is on a heating element. This may not be done even before Shabbat.<ref>Shulchan Aruch 257:8, Mishna Brurah 257:37, Halacha Brurah 257:28. <br /> | # One may not completely wrap a pot with a blanket or towel if the pot is on top of a hot plate, covered fire, or any other heating element. Even though the blanket or towel is considered something that doesn't add heat, it is nonetheless considered as something that adds heat once it is on top of a pot which is on a heating element. This may not be done even before Shabbat.<ref>Shulchan Aruch 257:8, Mishna Brurah 257:37, Halacha Brurah 257:28. <br /> | ||
* Tur 257:8, quoting the Rosh, writes that those people who insulate a pot on Friday with a cloth and put the pot on a covered fire are doing wrong, since the cloth is considered an insulation that adds heat once the pot is on top of a heating element. The Bet Yosef (257:8 s.v. u'ma shekatav rabenu aval hatmana) writes that Tosfot Shabbat 48a s.v. dzeytim held that it is forbidden to use a cloth to cover a pot on top of covered coals since the cloth becomes something that adds heat since the pot is on top of a heating element. He also quotes the Smag Lav 65, Smak 282, Sefer Hatrumah 231, and Ran (shabbat 22a s.v. aval) citing the Rabbenu Yonah and Rashba as agreeing. He does cite the Ran quoting the Ramban as disagreeing that hatmana and shehiya are two separate issues, and if a cloth isn't something that adds heat itself it isn't considered something that adds heat for hatmana. | * Tur 257:8, quoting the Rosh, writes that those people who insulate a pot on Friday with a cloth and put the pot on a covered fire are doing wrong, since the cloth is considered an insulation that adds heat once the pot is on top of a heating element. The Bet Yosef (257:8 s.v. u'ma shekatav rabenu aval hatmana) writes that Tosfot Shabbat 48a s.v. dzeytim held that it is forbidden to use a cloth to cover a pot on top of covered coals since the cloth becomes something that adds heat since the pot is on top of a heating element. He also quotes the Smag Lav 65, Smak 282, Sefer Hatrumah 231, and Ran (shabbat 22a s.v. aval) citing the Rabbenu Yonah and Rashba as agreeing. He does cite the Ran quoting the Ramban as disagreeing that hatmana and shehiya are two separate issues, and if a cloth isn't something that adds heat itself it isn't considered something that adds heat for hatmana. | ||
* Shulchan Aruch 257:8 follows the opinion of the Tosfot, Smag, Smak, Sefer Hatrumah, Rashba, Rabbenu Yonah, Rosh, and Tur unlike the Ramban. This is accepted by the achronim including Shulchan Aruch Harav 257:10, Mishna Brurah 257:37, and Halacha Brurah 257:28. Aruch Hashulchan 257:11 agrees and adds that the Rambam and Rif agree with Tosfot. Halacha Brurah 257:28 adds that the Nemukei Yosef b"b 10a agrees with Tosfot.</ref> According to Ashkenazim this is forbidden. According to Sephardim this is | * Shulchan Aruch 257:8 follows the opinion of the Tosfot, Smag, Smak, Sefer Hatrumah, Rashba, Rabbenu Yonah, Rosh, and Tur unlike the Ramban. This is accepted by the achronim including Shulchan Aruch Harav 257:10, Mishna Brurah 257:37, and Halacha Brurah 257:28. Aruch Hashulchan 257:11 agrees and adds that the Rambam and Rif agree with Tosfot. Halacha Brurah 257:28 adds that the Nemukei Yosef b"b 10a agrees with Tosfot.</ref> According to Ashkenazim this is forbidden. According to Sephardim this is forbidden, though someone who has a minhag to do so doesn't need to be stopped.<ref>Shulchan Aruch 257:8, Halacha Brurah 257:28-29, Chazon Ovadia Shabbat v. 1 p. 56. | ||
* According to Sephardim, Halacha Brurah 257:29 writes that someone who does insulate the pot before Shabbat with a blanket on top of the heating element, even though it is against most rishonim (Tosfot, Rosh, Tur, Smag, Smak, Sefer Hatrumah, Rashba, and Rabbenu Yonah) and Shulchan Aruch, someone who relies on the Ramban Shabbat 47b who holds that a cloth isn't considered something that adds heat even though the pot is on top of a heating element shouldn't be rebuked. (See there where he adds that although many rishonim are strict there are many who are lenient like the Ramban including Or Zaruah 2:8, Sefer Habatim ch. 5, Ohel Moed 3:10, Ritva Shabbat 47b quoting Rabbenu Tam, Sefer Hayashar no. 235, and Meiri 36b based on Rashi.) Furthermore, if the pot is heating food for the next day there is what to rely upon according to the Shibolei Haleket. Even though this is a minority opinion someone who follows it in conjugation with the Ramban shouldn't be rebuked.</ref> | * According to Sephardim, Halacha Brurah 257:29 writes that someone who does insulate the pot before Shabbat with a blanket on top of the heating element, even though it is against most rishonim (Tosfot, Rosh, Tur, Smag, Smak, Sefer Hatrumah, Rashba, and Rabbenu Yonah) and Shulchan Aruch, someone who relies on the Ramban Shabbat 47b who holds that a cloth isn't considered something that adds heat even though the pot is on top of a heating element shouldn't be rebuked. (See there where he adds that although many rishonim are strict there are many who are lenient like the Ramban including Or Zaruah 2:8, Sefer Habatim ch. 5, Ohel Moed 3:10, Ritva Shabbat 47b quoting Rabbenu Tam, Sefer Hayashar no. 235, and Meiri 36b based on Rashi.) Furthermore, if the pot is heating food for the next day there is what to rely upon according to the Shibolei Haleket. Even though this is a minority opinion someone who follows it in conjugation with the Ramban shouldn't be rebuked.</ref> | ||
# If one only covers the top of the pot, according to many Ashkenazi poskim, it isn't considered insulation since it is only partially covered and it is permitted even on Shabbat. The exact definition of a partial covering is if the pot is only covered with a blanket on the top and the sides are recognizably exposed for a majority of the circumference of the pot.<ref> | # If one only covers the top of the pot, according to many Ashkenazi poskim, it isn't considered insulation since it is only partially covered and it is permitted even on Shabbat. The exact definition of a partial covering is if the pot is only covered with a blanket on the top and the sides are recognizably exposed for a majority of the circumference of the pot.<ref> | ||
