Chodesh Elul: Difference between revisions
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* Similarly, [http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=1167&st=&pgnum=68 Rav Moshe Zachuto in Shu"t Ramaz 30] writes that it is important to only say selichot after chatzot. The Birkei Yosef 581:1, Mishna Brurah 565:12, Kaf HaChaim Orach Chaim 581:1,2, Kaf Hachaim Palacci 16:13, Chacham Ovadia Yosef (Yechave Daat 1:46; Chazon Ovadyah (Yamim Noraim, pg 2-3); Yalkut Yosef, Moadim page 9), and Ma'amar Mordechai (Rav Mordechai Eliyahu) 34:4 agree.<br> | * Similarly, [http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=1167&st=&pgnum=68 Rav Moshe Zachuto in Shu"t Ramaz 30] writes that it is important to only say selichot after chatzot. The Birkei Yosef 581:1, Mishna Brurah 565:12, Kaf HaChaim Orach Chaim 581:1,2, Kaf Hachaim Palacci 16:13, Chacham Ovadia Yosef (Yechave Daat 1:46; Chazon Ovadyah (Yamim Noraim, pg 2-3); Yalkut Yosef, Moadim page 9), and Ma'amar Mordechai (Rav Mordechai Eliyahu) 34:4 agree.<br> | ||
While Chacham Ovadia Yosef (Chazon Ovadia Yamim Noraim pg. 6-7) cites some opinions that one may say Selichot according to when Chatzot is in Israel, he concludes clearly that this is not an acceptable leniency </ref> However, some communities, such as the Spanish-Portuguese of London and Amsterdam, recited a condensed version of Selichot after Arvit before Kaddish Titkabal and some argue in favor of this custom<ref>See Keter Shem Tov vol. 5 page 13 who notes how the custom has no source in early Poskim and seems to just be a means of keeping the custom of Selichot alive for those whose inability to attend early in the morning will result in the obliteration of the custom. At the same time, Rav Gaguine notes, the communities in London and Amsterdam have no hand in Kabbalah, which is the source of the insistence not to recite Selichot before chatzot, in the first place. Therefore, there is no reason for them to change their practice due to other Poskim's Kabbalistic concerns. In those locales, it is anyway too cold to get up early in the morning, unlike Spain, so they also do Selichot at 7:00AM. Magen Avot (Orach Chaim fn. 437) refers to Darchei David who finds additional room for leniency to uphold the Spanish-Portuguese custom to do Selichot at night after Arvit.</ref> | While Chacham Ovadia Yosef (Chazon Ovadia Yamim Noraim pg. 6-7) cites some opinions that one may say Selichot according to when Chatzot is in Israel, he concludes clearly that this is not an acceptable leniency </ref> However, some communities, such as the Spanish-Portuguese of London and Amsterdam, recited a condensed version of Selichot after Arvit before Kaddish Titkabal and some argue in favor of this custom<ref>See Keter Shem Tov vol. 5 page 13 who notes how the custom has no source in early Poskim and seems to just be a means of keeping the custom of Selichot alive for those whose inability to attend early in the morning will result in the obliteration of the custom. At the same time, Rav Gaguine notes, the communities in London and Amsterdam have no hand in Kabbalah, which is the source of the insistence not to recite Selichot before chatzot, in the first place. Therefore, there is no reason for them to change their practice due to other Poskim's Kabbalistic concerns. In those locales, it is anyway too cold to get up early in the morning, unlike Spain, so they also do Selichot at 7:00AM. Magen Avot (Orach Chaim fn. 437) refers to Darchei David who finds additional room for leniency to uphold the Spanish-Portuguese custom to do Selichot at night after Arvit.</ref> | ||
Rav Moshe Feinstein writes that in extenuating circumstances one can say selichot before [[Chatzot]]. <ref>Rav Moshe Feinstein (Igrot Moshe O.C. 2:105) writes that although prior to [[Chatzot]] is not the ideal time, there is no prohibition to say [[Selichot]] at such a time, and as a Hora’at Sha’ah, one may be lenient. Saying them at this time is better than not saying them at all. His proof is Shulchan Aruch O.C. 1:2 who rules that praying at the end of the first third of the night is considered a time of mercy. Rav Moshe warns though that the congregation should be warned that this is only being done under the circumstances and next year we will do it at the proper time. <br> | # Rav Moshe Feinstein writes that in extenuating circumstances one can say selichot before [[Chatzot]]. <ref>Rav Moshe Feinstein (Igrot Moshe O.C. 2:105) writes that although prior to [[Chatzot]] is not the ideal time, there is no prohibition to say [[Selichot]] at such a time, and as a Hora’at Sha’ah, one may be lenient. Saying them at this time is better than not saying them at all. His proof is Shulchan Aruch O.C. 1:2 who rules that praying at the end of the first third of the night is considered a time of mercy. Rav Moshe warns though that the congregation should be warned that this is only being done under the circumstances and next year we will do it at the proper time. <br> | ||
* [http://www.torah.org/advanced/weekly-halacha/5757/nitzavim.html Rav Doniel Neustadt] says this shouldn't be relied upon on a consistent basis. | * [http://www.torah.org/advanced/weekly-halacha/5757/nitzavim.html Rav Doniel Neustadt] says this shouldn't be relied upon on a consistent basis. | ||
* see also [https://www.yutorah.org/lectures/lecture.cfm/933010/rabbi-isaac-rice/the-best-time-for-selichos-the-worst-time-for-selichos/ Rabbi Isaac Rice]</ref> | * see also [https://www.yutorah.org/lectures/lecture.cfm/933010/rabbi-isaac-rice/the-best-time-for-selichos-the-worst-time-for-selichos/ Rabbi Isaac Rice]</ref> | ||
